Rant - Feeling so hopeless about sleep!

[bababas]

lysh - congratulations on the standing cant wait for it. but then it will prolly be a drama to make aron fall asleep haha. he would prolly just wanna stand first for 2 hours.

amy - downward facing dog yoga pose it is wonderful being young haha. but sounds like developmental stuff i agree. uff the late naps are just not a good thing here either. they were ok before. but it seems aron is getting too old for them.

stephie - wow im quiet proud of your little man though that he is so good in communication letting you know when to nurse. aron is in that age where i have to nurse him in quiet. otherwise he starts rolling. but sorry for the 3 MOTN partied. man thats too much.

SE - so sorry to hear that about pumping in the middle of the night. and he has always been like that right, the need to feed to sleep? i hope it is something they can grow out of. but sleep training also sounds good. what 2 of my friends have been doing is walking them around until they fall back to sleep. but that doesnt really sound that much fun either. and you prolly have tried that already. some say music helps, baby music. but i have otherwise no experience. he sleeps in his crib right? it is not that he wants to co-sleep or anything? another friend told me that co-sleeping worked best for her. just really hope it gets better.

 

[seaweed eater]

Thanks everyone. I'm so sorry I haven't caught up, I've just been feeling overwhelmed to be honest. I've been trying to make a plan...this thread doesn't seem the right place for all of the details, even though some of it has to do with sleep, but if you are interested in the BF side of things, I'm planning to update here: https://babyandbump.momtastic.com/breastfeeding/1980035-has-survived-strike.html#post29205657

Tonight my goal is to see if I can somehow get Munchkin calm enough to cuddle in the rocking chair he's never enjoyed sitting still unless he's nursing or bottle feeding. He will only let me hold him if I'm walking around -- just as you said, Bababas -- and I don't want to introduce that as a sleep association now, although it might be a place to start if all else fails. It seems like, if there's no way to cuddle (so that singing or reading stories or whatever can then relax him further), then the only alternative will be to put him in his crib fully squirmy, which is a scary thought.

Bababas, I know co-sleeping is so wonderful for some people! To be honest it's just not something either DH or I want at all and I know it can be a really long-term commitment (unless you are willing to cause some tears later anyway) so we've avoided it. In addition to that, LO is very sensitive to noise so I worry that he would be waking up all the time -- maybe going back to sleep easily if he started nursing again, but having to deal with that while he's still refusing to nurse sounds really hard.

Still reading, and as always grateful to all of you for your support...will respond properly soon.

 

[lysh]

AmyS- You are a patient momma to rock for 2 hours! I tried sitting in the room with her and nursing her back to sleep...some mornings it would work, other mornings it would not. And to be honest, I was not always as consistent as I should have been because I was too tired to sit in the bedroom for hours!!!
Those were some crazy naps.....great that DH got her in her crib for an hour and a half!!!!

Stephie- If she does keep with this one nap a day,I agree it will probably make things easier. DD is always just coming up to me and 'helping herself' with nursing...even in the middle of chaos!

bababas- Yeah, I am expecting some wake-ups tonight because she will probably want to continue to practice her skill!!! She almost could not wait to start practicing this morning.

SE- Good luck!

We started our bedtime routine 15 minutes earlier and she was in her crib 10 minutes earlier than yesterday. Tomorrow we will try another 10 minutes earlier and see what happens!!!

 

[seaweed eater]

Lysh, I really hope the earlier sleep time results in a later morning for you tomorrow!! Glad to hear it worked

Munchkin was in a really bad mood tonight and refused milk for most of the evening, so I had to give him a bottle when he was sleepy so that he wouldn't go to bed hungry. I tried putting him in bed without the bottle and he was miserable, and because I figured he was hungry I couldn't let him cry for too long. He practically fell asleep on the bottle but I gave it to him out in the living room, and I read him a story and sang him a lullaby afterward before putting him in bed. He then cried for a couple of minutes and fell asleep. So, it's just a few minutes of separation between bottle and sleep -- a very tiny step -- but hopefully it gets us somewhere.

 

[lysh]

I am not sure what time she slept until- I woke up at 6 and immediately turned on the monitor- she was standing in her crib! lol So I just got her and we started the day. Unfortunately, had some errands to run so she fell asleep in the car at 9:45....that means a potential late nap!

 

[seaweed eater]

I always think, if you didn't hear anything, that means they were probably fine! Glad you yourself got some more sleep either way! I hope today goes ok.

 

[stephie_corin]

Bababas, thanks! I'm so pleased he finally seems to have returned to nursing at non-nap times. He used to feed every 1-1.5 hours and then overnight became distracted by the world! Did you breastfeed your first? Was he a good sleeper?

SE, I'm so sorry the strike is continuing. I hope things improve soon. I'll be reading your other thread with interest.

Lysh, good luck! I really hope the earlier bedtime works well for you guys! How funny she was playing in her crib when you woke - I wonder what time she woke up?!?

We had another MOTN party 10.30pm - 12.30. It's not teeth anymore so I guess it's developmental but he really doesn't seem to be working on anything new. He's been crawling and pulling up and cruising and climbing for a few months now and no sign of new tricks... maybe he just likes being awake in the night ...?

 

[seaweed eater]

Thanks Stephie I'm feeling better about it this morning because I got some good SLEEP! Munchkin slept 8:15-5:30-6:45 today. He almost never wakes up that late. Of course, I was up with him at 5:30 and then didn't have time to go back to sleep after pumping, but I will sooooo take it. He's drinking milk from a cup today so hopefully we can try to go completely bottle-free tonight. Eek!

I'm really sorry to hear about your MOTN. I hope tonight is better. When did you put him down last night? What do you do with him when he's awake for that long? I'm sure he has a lot of new tricks coming, btw...they always do!

 

[lysh]

Thanks ladies.....sorry Stephie..MOTN parties are so hard!!!!!

 

[bababas]

SE - wow he fell asleep without his bottle
and hurra to your good sleep.

lysh - good you got some longer sleep

stephie - i breastfed my first. and formula before bed (at 2 or 4 months i dont remember that well) coz we had some problems with breastfeeding. he was an easy baby. STTN at 5 months. never bothered by WW. hardly bothered by teething. and happy in his crib. opposite of aron but i dont find aron that difficult either. he is just different. sorry about more MOTN parties.

Aron woke up 4 times last night. ones i was able to sush him back to sleep. i think i woke him up when i went to bed around 10pm. Today we had 2 naps only, coz the owners of the house are painting, and etc. i couldnt give him a late nap. so he woke up today after i put him down to bed. was a bit grumpy. could be that he was overtired. but fell asleep on the boobie.

 

[NotNic]

Ladies I'm pooped! The balance of the world has been put right again. Current eye teeth breaking through and the top molars coming down have really knocked F. He has had multiple bad nights, high temp and had a mild fit (more like severe shakes). His nose is gunky and he has conjunctivitis. We took him to the drs yesterday and she has checked and apart from the eyes no infection. Her feeling is that his teething is behind all of it. He just has 3 more teeth to go (apart from the 2yr molars) and they can't come through quick enough!

I will try to post properly later on. Seaweed - F went on milk strike (though I wasn't nursing) around 10mths. It lasted a week then back to normal. There may be a blessing in disguise with this gap. Maybe he will start having fewer, more substantial feeds rather than snacks going forward. I know you enjoy nursing though, but if he does decide he's had enough, how great is it that he self-weaned naturally? Also is it hot where you are? I know when it was very humid when I was still bfing, he would push away from me. The closeness was too much for him in the hot weather.

 

[seaweed eater]

Not our very best night...of course, he slept 9-5:15 so that's good! But it was one of those evenings where the entire evening was spent putting him to sleep. He had such a tough time without any bottles or cups. We also finally had the dreaded appearance of sitting/standing in crib. I had been uncertain whether I would lay him down or not, but it quickly became a nonissue after I tried laying him down twice and he got really, really mad and just popped up again, so I had to leave him. He eventually fell asleep sitting up and I moved him after he was asleep. I hope he figures that out soon. I don't like it.

I think he could also have slept longer this morning if he hadn't sat up right away. He was really tired. We did our usual playtime in the dark and around 6 he actually crawled over to me, put his head on my leg, and fell asleep. Completely unlike him!! I transferred him to his crib awake but not crying. He slept for only another 10 min or so.

I hope he takes a good nap today. He did yesterday, but he needs it more today. I wish I could stay home today and give him a long nap at home so he doesn't get too tired, but I can't.

Seriously thinking of hiring a sleep consultant, since I found one whose basic values seem similar to mine. Still talking it through with DH.

More later

 

[AmyS]

Stephie - How was last night? More motn parties?

SE - Falling asleep sitting up!! It sounds really cute, but I agree, I am not looking forward to when this starts happening for Chloe. Is the sleep consultant near you so that they can actually be there in person?

NotNic - Wow, poor guy! He is just being terrorized by all of those teeth wanting to come in at once!

lysh - How are your earlier bedtimes going?

bababas - Have you thought about transitioning to 2 naps yet anyway?
_________________________

Well, we are definitely in the midst of a developmental stage. She is fighting naps - yesterday she took a nap (at home with my mom) from 10 - 11:45am, and then she wouldn't take an afternoon nap. I should have just put her to bed early, but I started trying for a catnap about 4:30pm, and she finally fell asleep from 5-5:30pm. So then it took forever to get her down for the night, and she woke up a couple of times and was really hard to settle. She keeps doing her yoga pose when she wakes and hopping her feet up in the air.

But, I really love this age!! She is just being so funny and cute!

 

[stephie_corin]

Bababas, it's amazing how different babies from the same family can be! Sorry about naps and overtiredness. I hope you have better luck tomorrow.

Notnic, I'm so sorry for your rough patch! Huge big hugs! (My autocorrect changed that to "huge pig bugs"). I hope Finlay starts to feel better soon and the teeth finish coming through. Wowsa - that is so much to happen all at once.

SE, I can't believe he fell asleep sitting up! We're you in the room or did you leave him to fall asleep? How long did it take him to fall asleep? Amazing night for you guys!

Amy, I really feel your pain regarding naps - Cully was staying up so late when he took that late catnap. I agree though, it's such a great age! How is she sleeping at night? I read something useful thats helped me a bit - if the first nap finishes close to 12, try a cat nap around 330 or some quiet time if they won't nap, and then go for an early bed time.

Our MOTN parties are continuing. I eventually rock him to sleep only for him to wake as soon as I put him down. At one point last night I was so tired I just propped myself upright with pillows and we slept like that for about an hour. I don't get it - he's actually standing independently less now than a month ago?! He's no interest in walking... I do wonder if he has more teeth coming through. He's only got two top and two bottom and he is tugging his ear at night?! But pain relief did nothing a few nights ago.

 

[seaweed eater]

I don't think I quite conveyed the mood in our house last night... As DH reminded me, it was actually 9:30, not 9. And we started trying to put him down at 7. Those 2 1/2 hours included ~45 minutes of playing happily, and the rest was crying. On the bright side...I think it's the longest he's struggled to go to sleep without throwing up? Is that a bright side? Hard to feel good about it somehow

Sleeping sitting up was scary! A few times he woke himself up by nodding and tipping sideways. In the end he fell asleep bent forward at the waist. It did not look comfortable!

The sleep consultant doesn't live near us so it would be a consultation over the phone. We will probably do it if she can find a time that works with DH's schedule.

Amy, it really is a fun age, even with the attendant sleep difficulties! I'm glad you are enjoying it. Sounds like yesterday ended up ok despite the unusual naps.

Stephie, I'm so sorry about your continued MOTN parties and rough nights whether it's teething or development, I'm sure there is a good reason for it. You're doing everything right and you know him best. I hope things get better again soon!!

 

[NotNic]

Finlay falls asleep sitting up ALL the time! We have bumpers and I leave him to it. 5/10mins after I can't hear him anymore I go up and lay him down. He also sits upright before he's awake. If we don't need him to be awake I just lay him down quickly and smoothly. Most the time he will go back no problem but we did have nights where he did it 10+ times. Hope that doesn't happen to you but if it does I hope it encourages you that he's mostly grown out of it!! He just tends to wake up with a bang sometimes!

 

[lysh]

bababas- Hope you had a good night!

Notnic- Hope those teeth pop out soon!! Teething is an exhausting process.

SE- Yikes, sounds like a long night! My LO is now standing in the crib when she wakes up rather than just crawling around. It is taking her longer now to settle back down when she wakes up during the night. I try going in and laying her on her back and it pisses her off too. Poor little one though, sleeping sitting up!!! How long did it take your LO to settle during the night?? Listening to them cry is so hard. You will see below, we had a tough night too.

Stephie- My LO started standing (not unassisted, but hanging off of furniture) when she was 9 1/2 months old. She hovered once and then that was it. She decided crawling was better at the moment and other than using furniture to hang onto and walk around, she had no interest in continuing to try to walk up until now. Maybe it is just phases they go through!!! I hope your MOTN parties get better soon!

So last night was a total fail. Started our bedtime routine at 7:10....she had a harder time settling this time, still got her to bed a little earlier. She decided at 3:40 she was waking up. We let her fuss for a while, but she was standing up in her crib and not settling down, so I went in and put her on her back. I rubbed her hair and patted her belly. She would start to fall asleep but then would wake back up. After 20 minutes (and my back was breaking from bending over the crib that long) I tucked her in and left the room. The screaming began....then she fussed for another 20 minutes. So after all of that, she finally fell back asleep at 4:50 and then woke up at 5:35. At that point I just brought her to bed to nurse and the stinker decided to go back to sleep in the bed with me until after 7.

So tomorrow I have to go to work for the day. First full day away from my sweetie in 10 weeks. She will be with my SIL, so hopefully naps will not be a total disaster and throw everything off.

 

[seaweed eater]

NotNic, I didn't respond to your update earlier. I'm so sorry F is suffering so badly with teething and everything!!! Poor baby and poor you! You must be exhausted. I hope things are back to normal soon! Thank you for telling me about F's milk strike. I think you're right on all counts as usual! It has been warm here (though he's still been cuddly). Perhaps I should have somehow helped him transition to fewer larger feeds earlier...oh well, what's done is done. So funny about him sleeping sitting up. From what I've heard it tends to be really disruptive for only a few days to a week...so I'm hopeful that will be the case for us. I told my physical therapist about it today and he said Munchkin must have great neck control to be able to fall asleep like that without falling over, so that goes for F too

Lysh, soooo sorry about your rough night. Earlier than 4 is just simply NOT OKAY. Babies? Are you reading this? It is NOT OKAY! I've decided not to lay mine down anymore. He can figure it out for himself. Let's see how long I last with that.

Bababas, how are things?

Bedtime was much better tonight!! It took two attempts but he was asleep before 8. He seemed to have a lot more trouble with sitting up than with the lack of boob or bottle. He never cried very intensely and he kept falling asleep and then nodding himself awake. He even tried sleeping in the same position as yesterday but couldn't. In the end he fell asleep and then fell backward. Poor Munchkin! But after he'd calmed down he was able to go to sleep lying down.

Go figure, he took a 30-minute nap today. I feel like "overtired or undertired?" (as in, which one does he tend to be when we're having difficulties) continues to be one of the central questions in my uncertainty about his sleep. Add tonight to the tally for "undertired." The sleep consultant is going to say overtired but I don't know if I believe that!

 

[stephie_corin]

SE that's a long bedtime... I feel for all three of you. He seems to have one bad night and then things get better. Oh wait, I just read your next update! I'm glad to hear things improved! I have the overtired/undertired debate too. With longer awake times Cully naps better and falls asleep easier. I hope the sleep consultant is helpful!

NotNic, I hope you slept better last night!!

Lysh, that's interesting about your girl and the crawling. I think Cully will be the same. He's very proficient at cruising, crawling, climbing but when I try to 'walk him' he kicks his legs and giggles. I'm so sorry about your rough night. I can't remember if I suggested this before, but are you guys ok with part time bed sharing? What if you brought her to your bed if she wakes at 3/4/5 and you could nurse her back to sleep and get some more sleep yourself. I know it's not for everyone.

Amy, Bababas, I hope you guys had good naps and even better nights.

We had a slightly better night. I'm sure my husband has some kind of magic sleep touch. For the first time in a long time he put Cully back to sleep when he woke around 10.30. I tried but it was looking like another long MOTNer. I went to brush my teeth and left DH to it and I came back and Cully was asleep. He then slept from 10.45-1am! This had been the time for our worst MOTN parties. I also tried feeding him as soon as he woke up and it seemed to help with the wakings too - he was quite easy to settle until 530am when he needed some rocking and slept until 6.15am.

 

[NotNic]

Yay Stephie for Daddy's magic touch!!i have a theory behind this though. Daddies don't offer milk and the same type of cuddles as Mummies do, so less reason to stay awake. When they know it isn't Mummy attending them they tend to give in sooner. In my experience Daddies are better at winding too. I could take an hour trying to settle F and my husband would come in and have him asleep in 2 mins. The only problem is DH is a massive grouch if I wake him up and isn't very nice so I have to weigh up crying baby vs. stroppy husband!

Seaweed I try but believe me I get it wrong a lot! I'm just further ahead than you are and I think our little ones have a few similarities Finlay definitely has a strong neck. He's inherited his Daddy's rugby player frame! Very useful for rucking. (I think that's what it's called )

Last night was better. As usual he stirred when we went to bed but I gave him some nurofen when he was half asleep and apart from waking a little at 12.30 slept until just after 6am. His eyes didnt need cleaning like they have done for the last few days so the drops are working well too.