Rant - Feeling so hopeless about sleep!

[NotNic]

Sorry to hear that Polaris. You really seem to suffer with every change.

Also I have to say much kudos to all of you who co-sleep on the floor. I don't know how you get any sleep!!! We're staying in a cottage for a week and we arrived late last night to discover they haven't provided a cot. Last night we put a mattress on the floor and made him up a bed. He did nap late 4-6pm in the car, but didnt nap at all before and we were at a kid's party so he should have been worn out. His routine was all out as he ate at 7.30 and then stayed awake until we arrived. Unfortunately it took him two more hours before he went to sleep! Finally nodding off at 00.15am!! He was running around in the dark, opening drawers, banging etc. I'm hoping it was the novelty because I can't last all week if they don't have a cot for him today!!

 

[keese22]

Having a bit of a rough time, don't really know what to do for the best.
Lo is almost 7 months old, he is BF and we are BLW as he won't let me spoon feed him.
He does nap ok, it just takes forever for me to get him to nap. He doesn't really feed to sleep that much anymore so I've been laying down with him and he shouts for a while then goes to sleep and I then transfer him to his cot. The thing is I'm getting so frustrated as he's tired he just won't go to sleep. I can be laying there for an hour at times with him. He had a wake time of around 2-2.5 hours and 3 naps a day. This morning I was getting so frustrated I felt the best thing to do was to put him in his cot . He winged /cried for half an hour and I went in every 2-3 mins to settle him and he eventually fell asleep. My husband thinks I am doing the right thing as he will only settle for me but I feel awful. I always said I wouldn't cc but its also no good me gettig frustrated with him as he isn't doing it on purpose. I just needed to get this out I don't know what I'm going to do for the next nap time ad bedtime. I guess consistency is the key :/

 

[polaris]

Notnic, I think it depends what they are used to. Thomas absolutely loved his cot and there's no way I would have gone on holiday without a cot because it would have been just like you describe, he just wouldn't have realized it was time to sleep! Whereas Clara is fine in that regard. She does crawl around the bed a bit if she's undertired but generally she associates the futon with going to sleep so she doesn't get off the bed or try to play etc. (I also have her in a sleeping bag which does restrict her mobility a bit!) I hope they have a cot for you tonight!! He could have been a bit overtired too after so much excitement and disruption to the usual routine. Enjoy your holiday!!

Keese, welcome! The first thing that I was thinking was that your LO might be starting into the 3:2 nap transition, so might be a bit undertired when you are trying to put him down for a nap. I think it sounds like a really good plan to try to get him used to going to sleep himself in the cot. I would definitely keep going with what you are doing if you are comfortable with it. It sounds like he fell asleep quicker without you lying beside him so it could be that you lying with him is too stimulating for him now that he is older and more alert. My older boy was like this and fell asleep much better on his own. If that is the case you might want to space out the checks a bit if he is just whinging rather than distressed. (DD is the opposite and won't let me leave the room at all, just as an aside!)

 

[keese22]

Thank you, it's good to hear that people don't think I'm a horrible mum! I think you're right and he does get over stimulated by me. What is the recommended time for checks? (I'd go in sooner if he got too distressed)

Lunch time nap was better. He had his lunch, I put him in his gro bag. Quick breastfeed downstairs then I put him in his cot as said time for a nap. He shouted for about 10 mins. He didn't really cry and then we went to sleep
Sat with a hot chocolate with my feet up and a bit of telly

 

[keese22]

I tried again this evening. I lasted 40 mins and I was outside his door sobbing, I can't do it we were thinking about introducing a dummy for naps or something a bottle gentler . I feel awful

 

[keese22]

A bit gentler even!

 

[bababas]

We had a 2 hour MOTN party last night. I feel like I rocked him for hours and hours. Daddy was getting in on the rocking action too and C just kept babbling away.

Bababas, your neighbourhood sounds hilarious!! That's great that Aron is doing his first stretch in his own bed. It must give you some nice relaxation time! Sorry that naps aren't in synch anymore. Good luck for the party!! Edit - I just saw Aron has an ear infection too! So sorry. I hope he feels better soon!

had a bit of a MOTN last night. but only 30 mins, so cant complain. seemed more like he had difficulties falling back to sleep.

we went to the doctor again to double check if the infection was gone. thank god it is gone.

 

[bababas]

Hey i'm currently doing 1 nap she's a little tired during the day but she will prob just get used to it..

I had this blanket in her crib i always folded it tight to the bottom so she couldn't get caught in it but lately she's been pulling it out and making a pillow out of that blanket and falling asleep on it.. so last night in the night she was rolling around on it in the middle of the night to get comfortable.. i gave her a bottle and accidently passed out opps ( i'm tired) and she seriously slept from 3am-9am i thought i was going to have a bad night because she went to bed at 8 and woke up for the first time at 130 then 3 but i was refusing to give her milk until atleast 3am because OH is dumb and gave her 16 oz yes 16 oz before bed .. augh and woke up at 130 for more.. uh no! lol

anyhow its the longest stretch she's done in forever i dont no if it was because of the blankets made like a pillow she was comfy like that or what

She's having her first nap of the day and i took a pillow off my bed and gave it to her and shes been napping forever....

Should i just give her a pillow now she's almost a year old on the 6th of october? the pillow i gave her is kinda flat its not a super fluffy pillow or anything

good news on the long stretch. hehe. Ívar and Aron had a pillow early on. It is also quiet flat.

 

[polaris]

Keese
Please don't be too hard on yourself. We are all just feeling our way through this and it's not easy to know what is the right thing to do at times. Sleep training is a good fit for some families/babies and not for others. Maybe take a step back and take a bit of time to decide which is the right approach for you. Have you tried a dummy with him before?

What is your boy's daily routine like at the moment? There might be something you could tweak in his routine that might help. Undertired and overtired can both make it very difficult for them to settle to sleep (sometimes the problem is knowing which one you are dealing with, LOL).

 

[bababas]

Thats an amazing idea thank you so much i'm doing that before her bed time tonight..

Soooo last night she went to bed around 830 by the time she actually fell asleep and woke up at 1 am and slept right through till 730am...

I'm amazed right now..

Watch tonight i'll have the bnb curse !! lol

no hopefully now bnb curse. shooo shooo. hehe

 

[bababas]

Sorry everyone, I've completely fallen behind. I have been reading but haven't had time to comment.

Clara's sleep has been quite bad. She is definitely in nap transition now and is having lots of one nap days. Days that she is having two naps they are generally both very short. She's coping well with it though and we've only had a couple of really over-tired meltdown evenings. I have no idea what time to aim for bedtime at the moment and it varies a lot.

There has not been any improvement in her night wakings. As of today, I am trying cutting out dairy from both of our diets, because I have noticed a couple of times that she has been particularly bad after a creamy dinner, waking a lot crying and with a lot of wind. Fingers crossed it helps a bit!!

sorry for the bad sleep i hope the new diet will work. keep us updated.

 

[bababas]

Also I have to say much kudos to all of you who co-sleep on the floor. I don't know how you get any sleep!!! We're staying in a cottage for a week and we arrived late last night to discover they haven't provided a cot. Last night we put a mattress on the floor and made him up a bed. He did nap late 4-6pm in the car, but didnt nap at all before and we were at a kid's party so he should have been worn out. His routine was all out as he ate at 7.30 and then stayed awake until we arrived. Unfortunately it took him two more hours before he went to sleep! Finally nodding off at 00.15am!! He was running around in the dark, opening drawers, banging etc. I'm hoping it was the novelty because I can't last all week if they don't have a cot for him today!!

oh boy. i hope he only got excited due to the party. i notice aron has difficulties falling asleep when he is excited. or if we have been somewhere or did something not at home.

 

[bababas]

Having a bit of a rough time, don't really know what to do for the best.
Lo is almost 7 months old, he is BF and we are BLW as he won't let me spoon feed him.
He does nap ok, it just takes forever for me to get him to nap. He doesn't really feed to sleep that much anymore so I've been laying down with him and he shouts for a while then goes to sleep and I then transfer him to his cot. The thing is I'm getting so frustrated as he's tired he just won't go to sleep. I can be laying there for an hour at times with him. He had a wake time of around 2-2.5 hours and 3 naps a day. This morning I was getting so frustrated I felt the best thing to do was to put him in his cot . He winged /cried for half an hour and I went in every 2-3 mins to settle him and he eventually fell asleep. My husband thinks I am doing the right thing as he will only settle for me but I feel awful. I always said I wouldn't cc but its also no good me gettig frustrated with him as he isn't doing it on purpose. I just needed to get this out I don't know what I'm going to do for the next nap time ad bedtime. I guess consistency is the key :/

sorry. last week when aron was sick he wouldnt eat puree at all. i had to give him BLW stuff. now he is good on puree again. our boys are at similar age. aron is only napping 2 times. he dropped the 3rd nap about 1.5 weeks ago. have you tried 2 naps?

 

[bababas]

I tried again this evening. I lasted 40 mins and I was outside his door sobbing, I can't do it we were thinking about introducing a dummy for naps or something a bottle gentler . I feel awful

maybe it is just the first night. and it will get better tomorrow? i would try maybe a bit more. unless if there is no improvement. i am thinking about sleep training too. but since he still just falls asleep while breastfeeding i am kind of too lazy for it.

 

[bababas]

last night was not so good. but saturday night was fine. thank god, since i went to my work party. OH was able to make aron fall asleep. he slept in his bed and fed only twice.

therefore last night was not so nice lol. i think he was too excited perhaps coz we had guests? ah well you never know.
he woke up 10pm, 12pm, i dont remember but i think 4 times. and at 2 am he was just babbling and then had difficulties to fall asleep. he fell asleep on his own though beside me eventually. i pretended to be asleep, ofcourse i couldnt sleep but had my eyes closed. so i felt a bit bummed when we woke up 7am. but had to go to the doc to check his ears again.

doc advised to stop night feedings. i was like how. he said just let OH sleep with him. i said but OH is working. he was like naaaa who cares. it seems like a good idea.... but i dont know, i think i am not ready yet. since i am not working at the moment i still could go with the flow, i still have hope that he might one day sttn on his own. he drank a lot last night though. i wonder if it is real hunger? or maybe teething...

 

[seaweed eater]

Stephie, I'm glad you've had some relatively good nights. I hope that continues for a while!! I'd love to know how Cully likes having a pillow, when you try that. We are waiting until 18 months to introduce one but I'm really looking forward to it. Munchkin loves smushing his face into our pillows or into his old nursing pillows.

Polaris, so sorry you guys are struggling. Her sleep does seem so sensitive. I hope that cutting dairy helps. Your children are so lucky to have such a patient and caring mama.

NotNic, I can't believe F stayed up past midnight!!! As Polaris said, I'm sure toddlers who sleep on the floor get used to it, but for a crib sleeper it makes sense that one random night without a cot is extremely stimulating. I hope things are better tonight and you enjoy the rest of your holiday!

Keese, so sorry you are having a tough time I'm one of the rare thread participants nowadays who does use sleep training techniques, but everyone is always very supportive, and no one will say you're a horrible mum! Polaris gave you some great advice -- I was going to say many of the same things she did.

I think you are right that consistency is the important thing. This might sound harsh, but I think that does mean that you have to be prepared for your LO to have a hard time. It doesn't mean you are being mean and horrible. Change is hard! But if you give her a predictable new structure she will adjust to it.

DH and I have adopted a more flexible approach to the checks. I am not comfortable with the idea of LO being left alone if he is truly distressed. So I respond based on what I feel he needs. I do try to leave at least 5 minutes between checks, usually more, so that I'm not popping in and out all the time, because I know my LO finds that very stimulating. But if he's having a tough time I stay with him for longer before leaving, and I sometimes touch him or pick him up. As long as he sees me leaving and falls asleep without me in the room. It's not perfect but it has helped his sleep a lot, and it's the only approach that really fits my parenting style, so it might be something to try if you are having a tough time with more traditional sleep training approaches

Bababas, I'm glad your work party evening out went well, but sorry last night was difficult! Are his ears getting better? (was it both ears?! ouch!) Doctors always make it sound so simple...I think, since you seem open to the idea in general, you will know when you're ready.

AFU, we'll see how Munchkin does this week with longer days at daycare...
The past few nights have been comparatively rough. He's just seemed to have a hard time settling. I've broken the night weaning rules and given him milk twice (once was at bedtime but after we'd already started the routine) because he was so upset. Each time the milk has helped, but I can't tell whether it's the calories or the comfort. We are really trying to feed him a lot during the day but maybe he needs more now that he's walking? Or maybe it's WW55...or teething. I just hope we're able to get back on track.

 

[lysh]

I am just checking in.....I have a lot of catching up to do! I have not fallen off the face of the earth, just exhausted!!!! Busy start to the school year and LO is back to waking up between 4:30-5. When my eyes are not half closed, I will catch up!

 

[stephie_corin]

Polaris, I'm sorry about your update - I really thought walking might make Clara so tired she'd sleep beautifully! Hopefully cutting dairy is the solution. Also, when she finishes making the 2:1 nap transition she might sleep better? Here's hoping anyway.

Notnic, I'm sure the nighttime antics weren't funny at the time but I relayed your story to my DH over lunch and we both had a chuckle. Finlay is such a spunky little boy. Any improvements for you guys or did you locate a cot?

Keese, I'm glad he was able to self settle for his nap! That's amazing news. I'm sorry the night was so tough though. Definitely no judgement here. If I recall correctly (SE will be able to confirm) - you can usually successfully use different methods for naps and nighttime. If he is getting very distressed at night you could try the gradual withdrawal method where you stay in the room. Although as Polaris says, this might be too over stimulating for him. Can he be fed or rocked to sleep if you decide the sleep training is too hard? Good luck and keep us updated!

Bababas, regarding the night feedings, I think you guys should make your own mind up and don't be pushed into something by the doctor. A lot of breastfeeding advice is outdated and doctors are not always the best ones to advise us on these issues. I'm sure you know that though do what feels right for you. Did you know you can buy the same instrument that the doctors use to check their ears? I've ordered one off amazon so that I can keep an eye on things myself. Apparently they are really easy to use and the one I bought is intended for home use by parents and comes with a guide about what to look for.

SE, I'm sorry things have been rough. I really like your flexible approach to sleep training. I think it's tough to make a hard and fast rule for sleep training because there are so many unforeseen stages in their development. How are Munchkin's naps? Is he taking them easily? He's likely to start transitioning back to one nap in the next few months - I wonder if 2 naps is affecting his bedtime? Or it could be any number of the factors you mentioned!

Lysh, sorry about the early wakeups. I wonder if you could put a mattress in a baby proof space and get some more sleep while she plays next to you? Although I think Cully would delight in hitting me with things and pulling my hair if I tried that!

We had a bit of a rough night - back to hourly wakeups with a couple of two hourly stretches. I'm sure he's teething. He has the little white squares in his gum at the top of his mouth. No sign of the 3rd and 4th bottom teeth though? I thought they came first.

 

[keese22]

Thank you everyone. I'm goin to keep trying to put him down for naps as he didn't get that upset and not sure about the night yet. When they drop naps which nap is it that usually goes??

 

[stephie_corin]

Keese, I found it wasn't so much that one nap disappeared - the two remaing naps happened at different times. So I pushed the first wake time longer (2.5 hours) and the second waketime to 3-3.5 hours and bedtime 4ish so hours after that. It's worth experimenting with awake times because we have variously done: 2.5, 3.5, 4 and 3, 3.5, 3.5 and 2, 2.5, 5... If he is sleeping well at night and taking good naps you know you've got a good formula if he gives strong tired signals (eye rub, yawning) this is your best indication. Good luck!