Rant - Feeling so hopeless about sleep!

[MrsPear]

Sorry Shadowy Lady, I have been so busy recently I've just not had chance to read through! I'm sorry you're still finding it so hard to sleep. That's really, really hard. I find it hard to sleep too, I'm always feeling too alert in case Joni wakes up even when she doesn't. I feel like even when she has a good night I'm still just as zonked the next day. I'm sorry you feel the same too, it's totally rubbish isn't it.

Joni has been sleeping better since being in her own room. Not perfectly, but only waking 2 or 3 times and it's totally manageable. The biggest difference is this night time routine that I have started. I have tried to do it before, but I'd say the reason it has worked this time is simply because she was ready for it and can understand a routine better, because all the other times she has simply cried and cried and not understood the 'cues' to sleep like the music I have and the low lights. So that's a relief.

Noelle, poor Charlotte. A double ear infection is enough to stop an adult in their tracks, so for a baby it must be so rough. No wonder her sleep has been less than brilliant again. Sometimes just getting up a few times can still leave you exhausted especially if each time is prolonged or you didn't get much rest for the previous few nights too.

Bananaz I know what you mean about 'not pushing the issue' e.g. with self settling. Everything is such tiny baby steps! But I don't think it would work for Joni any other way, and possibly Elsie too- I really feel like she needs to learn one small thing at a time. But sometimes I'm impatient to get more results!

Katrina- I am glad that Joni can't roll yet for the very reason that I don't want to have to deal with it at night! Sounds so hard. You say you shouldn't let her sleep on her tummy but I definitely believe that you do what you have to do to help them sleep and sometimes I personally think you have to break some of the rules to keep your sanity. I have let Joni sleep on me overnight before, which I know is really bad, but I just felt all I could do is make it as safe as possible because it's so incredibly hard having a baby that just won't sleep.

Tentoes- Like the others said that is probably fairly standard for your LO's age. BUT that doesn't mean it isn't just as difficult. From 0-8 weeks Joni was confused about night and day and everyone said it was normal- it DID NOT mean that I wasn't just as frustrated! I was going out of my tree with tiredness. I do hope that it passes for you soon then, try not to despair just yet, time passes very quickly and hopefully you will get some much needed sleep soon

x

 

[bananaz]

Shadowy Lady - I'm sorry things are rough It's so frustrating how variable and random baby sleep can be!

Noelle - I'm sorry you had a tough night as well. Do you have any idea what's keeping you awake? Waiting for the next baby wakeup or anxiety or something else? I've started doing deep breathing/positive thinking exercises while I'm trying to go to sleep, and they've actually been helpful.

MrsPear - I'm so glad Joni is sleeping better in her own room and that the new routine is working! They definitely do have to be at a certain stage of development before a routine becomes meaningful or useful.


Elsie had a pretty good night last night, despite a rough start. She took a really late 20-minute nap in the car and then wouldn't go to sleep when I tried to nurse her down so I just set in her crib awake. She fussed for a few minutes but then stopped abruptly and when I checked the video monitor she was STANDING holding onto the front of her crib! She promptly fell onto her butt and didn't manage to pull herself up again but oh god, why now??

Anyway, she finally did go to sleep (on her own! happily! with no crying!) around 7:45pm and slept until 12:30am when she resettled herself after only a few minutes of fussing. She woke again at 3:40am when I nursed her, and then she was up for the day at 6:20am. So all in all really not bad, but I know that it's only a matter of time before the standing thing becomes a problem. I guess we might as well get all of these milestones out of the way at once, huh?

 

[jessicatunnel]

Wow, bananaz, elsie is learning so many new things at once! Her mind must be in overdrive!

Sorry I've been MIA the last couple days.
I think Lilly is getting frustrated with trying to do things lately and she's been sooooo grumpy and needy. Pretty much wanting to be constantly held and I can't do that when I have things to do around the house! I can't even take a shower anymore until dh gets home! Ughhhhh.

Her sleep has pretty much been the same. She's only been waking once between her bedtime and mine which is an improvement but then she's waking up more at night again. She's been waking about three times at night now. So still pretty normal.

Not much else to report.

 

[Noelle610]

Bananaz, that is kind of hilarious! Elsie is clearly a really smart kid and this stuff is just messing her sleep up. I wouldn't be suprised if you find she's a champion sleeper after you get all of these milestones out of the way. I think crawling is the last big one in terms of sleep disruption.

MrsPear, bedtime routines are GREAT. While we've always struggled with night wakings, Charlotte usually goes down like a champ and I think our bedtime routine has helped. It gives her the signal that it's night time and offers an opportunity to wind down.

Bananaz, I think it's anxiety. Charlotte is an unpredictable sleeper and that keeps me on edge. I've always been a bit obsessive about sleep and getting enough. When I was pregnant I just prayed I'd have a good sleeper because of how much sleep I required. Well, that didn't happen! I've found melatonin helps me fall asleep, but I have difficulty going back to sleep after the first time I wake. I've tried some meditation that has helped part of the time, but sometimes I think it keeps me up longer as I'm so focused on relaxing that it has the opposite effect! I honestly think I'm suffering from a bit of postpartum insomnia, which is partially hormonal, and likely need an anti-depressent/anti-anxiety med. I made an appointment to see my midwife next week. I truly think if I could sleep when Charlotte sleeps I would be able to be decently rested at least part of the time. My DH is always teasing me because he can't understand HOW I don't get enough sleep when Charlotte has decent nights.

What's been helping me with this sleep stuff lately is just to have some pesrpective. Things change SO quickly, so when it's bad it's bound to get better at some point. I also think this is a short phase that won't last long. They won't be babies forever!

 

[mrsbeano]

Wow, bananaz, elsie is learning so many new things at once! Her mind must be in overdrive!

Sorry I've been MIA the last couple days.
I think Lilly is getting frustrated with trying to do things lately and she's been sooooo grumpy and needy. Pretty much wanting to be constantly held and I can't do that when I have things to do around the house! I can't even take a shower anymore until dh gets home! Ughhhhh.

Her sleep has pretty much been the same. She's only been waking once between her bedtime and mine which is an improvement but then she's waking up more at night again. She's been waking about three times at night now. So still pretty normal.

Not much else to report.

Hi Jessica

Just to let you know the clingyness may be teething related. For Quinn despite him showing what I thought was teething symptoms for ages he had no teeth and then last Monday he was sooo clingy and needy that I couldn't even put him in his buggy for a walk, let alone get anything done at home. I just stayed in for the rest of the week and held him all the time. Well on Saturday, we felt his first tooth!

He is now significantly happier and I feel bad for being so frustrated with him screaming at me if I put him down last week

Now if only he could learn how to sleep haha. The latest thing is waking up between 11-12 for a feed again?! I have given up. He is going to be the child who is waking up until he's at school. I'm just saving up for plastic surgery I'll need to look young

 

[mrsbeano]

Mrs Pear - so glad you've seen an improvement. Think we were both feeling desperate last week x

Noelle - I can't tell you how much I wished for a good sleeper too. My sister has a baby who is 21 weeks older than Quinn and he has slept through since he was 9 weeks. She stole my luck and I am soooo jealous. Hope your MW can give you something to help sleep when she does.

Bananaz - hope it clicks into place soon for Elsie

Shadowy - I HATE it when it feels like you're going backwards. Hopefully it is just a short blip in the proceedings and she'll get back on track quickly x

 

[Noelle610]

Noelle - I can't tell you how much I wished for a good sleeper too. My sister has a baby who is 21 weeks older than Quinn and he has slept through since he was 9 weeks. She stole my luck and I am soooo jealous. Hope your MW can give you something to help sleep when she does.

Is god testing us?! Why did we get so unlucky? Don't get me wrong, my little girl ROCKS, but man I wish she would stop waking at night. The worst was when she was a newborn and my perspective was totally bonkers. I had three close friends in my mom & baby group and two of the babies started STTN at 6 weeks and the other woke maybe once or twice from that time on. I REALLY thought I was doing something wrong. If you search my posts, you will find one titled "8 Week Old Baby not STTN" or somthing like that. Most of the more experienced moms told me I was being ridiculous, but I just didn't know that some babies just don't sleep for a long time!

 

[mrsbeano]

Noelle - I can't tell you how much I wished for a good sleeper too. My sister has a baby who is 21 weeks older than Quinn and he has slept through since he was 9 weeks. She stole my luck and I am soooo jealous. Hope your MW can give you something to help sleep when she does.

Is god testing us?! Why did we get so unlucky? Don't get me wrong, my little girl ROCKS, but man I wish she would stop waking at night. The worst was when she was a newborn and my perspective was totally bonkers. I had three close friends in my mom & baby group and two of the babies started STTN at 6 weeks and the other woke maybe once or twice from that time on. I REALLY thought I was doing something wrong. If you search my posts, you will find one titled "8 Week Old Baby not STTN" or somthing like that. Most of the more experienced moms told me I was being ridiculous, but I just didn't know that some babies just don't sleep for a long time!

Me either. I had been told that it improves by 6 weeks and they STTN by 12 weeks. Quinn isn't the worst but I'm a ten hours a night kinda gal if left to my own devices. That would happen every Friday and Saturday night. I did know that would go out the window but I thought that by 12 weeks I would be getting good sleep again.

Also - biggest shock, who the heck decides that 5 hours is STTN. That's a loada **** haha.

Oh well, only another 3-4 years before they get it

 

[Noelle610]

Noelle - I can't tell you how much I wished for a good sleeper too. My sister has a baby who is 21 weeks older than Quinn and he has slept through since he was 9 weeks. She stole my luck and I am soooo jealous. Hope your MW can give you something to help sleep when she does.

Is god testing us?! Why did we get so unlucky? Don't get me wrong, my little girl ROCKS, but man I wish she would stop waking at night. The worst was when she was a newborn and my perspective was totally bonkers. I had three close friends in my mom & baby group and two of the babies started STTN at 6 weeks and the other woke maybe once or twice from that time on. I REALLY thought I was doing something wrong. If you search my posts, you will find one titled "8 Week Old Baby not STTN" or somthing like that. Most of the more experienced moms told me I was being ridiculous, but I just didn't know that some babies just don't sleep for a long time!

Me either. I had been told that it improves by 6 weeks and they STTN by 12 weeks. Quinn isn't the worst but I'm a ten hours a night kinda gal if left to my own devices. That would happen every Friday and Saturday night. I did know that would go out the window but I thought that by 12 weeks I would be getting good sleep again.

Also - biggest shock, who the heck decides that 5 hours is STTN. That's a loada **** haha.

Oh well, only another 3-4 years before they get it

Yup, I thought the same! Surely all babies slept the night by 12 weeks... and if they didn't, you were doing something WRONG.

Oh well, like you said... just a few more years

 

[Noelle610]

Even if you're not "sleep training", this is hilarious. Enjoy ladies:

OK, here's my situation. My Mommy has had me for almost 3 months. The first few weeks were great--I cried, she picked me up and fed me, anytime, around the clock. Then something happened. Over the last few weeks, she has been trying to STTN (sleep thru the night). At first, I thought it was just a phase, but it is only getting worse. I've talked to other babies, and it seems like its pretty common after Mommies have had us for around 5-6 months. Here's the thing: these Mommies don't really need to sleep. It's just a habit. Many of them have had some 30 years to sleep--they just don't need it anymore. So I am implementing a plan. I call it the Crybaby Shuffle.

It goes like this:

Night 1--cry every 3 hours until you get fed. I know, it's hard. It's hard to see your Mommy upset over your crying. Just keep reminding yourself, it's for her own good.

Night 2--cry every 2 hours until you get fed.

Night 3--every hour.

Most Mommies will start to respond more quickly after about 3 nights. Some Mommies are more alert, and may resist the change longer. These Mommies may stand in your doorway for hours, shhhh-ing. Don't give in. I cannot stress this enough: CONSISTENCY IS KEY!! If you let her STTN (sleep through the night), just once, she will expect it every night. I KNOW IT'S HARD! But she really does not need the sleep; she is just resisting the change.. If you have an especially alert Mommy, you can stop crying for about 10 minutes, just long enough for her to go back to bed and start to fall asleep. Then cry again. It WILL eventually work. My Mommy once stayed awake for 10 hours straight, so I know she can do it.

The other night, I cried every hour. You just have to decide to stick to it and just go for it. BE CONSISTENT! I cried for any reason I could come up with:

My sleep sack tickled my foot.

I felt a wrinkle under the sheet.

My mobile made a shadow on the wall.

I burped, and it tasted like rice cereal. I hadn't eaten rice cereal since breakfast, what's up with that?

The dog said "ruff". I should know. My Mommy reminds me of this about 20 times a day. LOL.

Once I cried just because I liked how it sounded when it echoed on the monitor in the other room.

Too hot, too cold, just right--doesn't matter! Keep crying!!

I had drooled so much my sheets were damp and I didn't like it touching me.

I decided I was sick of all the pink in my room so I cried.

It took awhile, but it worked. She fed me at 4am. Tomorrow night, my goal is 3:30am. You need to slowly shorten the interval between feedings in order to reset your Mommies' internal clocks. Sometimes my Mommy will call for reinforcements by sending in Daddy. Don't worry Daddies are not set up for not needing sleep the way Mommies are. They can only handle a few pats and shhing before they declare defeat and send in the Mommy.

Also, be weary of the sleep sheep with rain noises. I like to give Mommy false hope that listening to the rain puts me to sleep. Sometimes I pretend to close my eyes and be asleep and then wait until I know Mommy is settling back to sleep to spring a surprise cry attack. If she doesn't get to me fast enough I follow up with my fake cough and gag noise that always has her running to the crib. At some point I am positive she will start to realize that she really doesn't really need sleep.

P.S. Don't let those rubber things fool you, no matter how long you suck on them, no milk will come out. Trust me.

 

[bananaz]

Bananaz, that is kind of hilarious! Elsie is clearly a really smart kid and this stuff is just messing her sleep up. I wouldn't be suprised if you find she's a champion sleeper after you get all of these milestones out of the way. I think crawling is the last big one in terms of sleep disruption.

I hope you're right! I've felt for a long time that deep down she really is a "good" sleeper, she just has so much else going on that it gets in her way. Maybe that's just me trying to make myself feel better though

Bananaz, I think it's anxiety. Charlotte is an unpredictable sleeper and that keeps me on edge. I've always been a bit obsessive about sleep and getting enough. When I was pregnant I just prayed I'd have a good sleeper because of how much sleep I required. Well, that didn't happen! I've found melatonin helps me fall asleep, but I have difficulty going back to sleep after the first time I wake. I've tried some meditation that has helped part of the time, but sometimes I think it keeps me up longer as I'm so focused on relaxing that it has the opposite effect! I honestly think I'm suffering from a bit of postpartum insomnia, which is partially hormonal, and likely need an anti-depressent/anti-anxiety med. I made an appointment to see my midwife next week. I truly think if I could sleep when Charlotte sleeps I would be able to be decently rested at least part of the time. My DH is always teasing me because he can't understand HOW I don't get enough sleep when Charlotte has decent nights.

What's been helping me with this sleep stuff lately is just to have some pesrpective. Things change SO quickly, so when it's bad it's bound to get better at some point. I also think this is a short phase that won't last long. They won't be babies forever!

I totally get all of this. I know my hormones are still way out of whack from pregnancy and breastfeeding and I'm sure if I got that under control my sleep would improve, I just haven't found the time/energy to go see anyone about it yet. Anyway, I hope your midwife is helpful and that you're able to find some kind of medication to help with the anxiety. Being a mom is hard enough as it is!

 

[Noelle610]

Bananaz, that is kind of hilarious! Elsie is clearly a really smart kid and this stuff is just messing her sleep up. I wouldn't be suprised if you find she's a champion sleeper after you get all of these milestones out of the way. I think crawling is the last big one in terms of sleep disruption.

I hope you're right! I've felt for a long time that deep down she really is a "good" sleeper, she just has so much else going on that it gets in her way. Maybe that's just me trying to make myself feel better though

I find myself feeling the same way! It's strange to admit I think of Charlotte as a "good sleeper", but I just feel that deep down she is and something - be it developmental milestones, reflux, illness, whatever - is keeping her from her true nature. It sounds ridiculous, but I think it's true!

 

[bananaz]

LOL That is awesome, Noelle!

 

[MrsPear]

Bananaz, that is kind of hilarious! Elsie is clearly a really smart kid and this stuff is just messing her sleep up. I wouldn't be suprised if you find she's a champion sleeper after you get all of these milestones out of the way. I think crawling is the last big one in terms of sleep disruption.

I hope you're right! I've felt for a long time that deep down she really is a "good" sleeper, she just has so much else going on that it gets in her way. Maybe that's just me trying to make myself feel better though

I find myself feeling the same way! It's strange to admit I think of Charlotte as a "good sleeper", but I just feel that deep down she is and something - be it developmental milestones, reflux, illness, whatever - is keeping her from her true nature. It sounds ridiculous, but I think it's true!

I always think this! Joni can sleep several hours, I know she can...but stuff gets in the way!! It's not her sleeping, it's everything else. x

 

[Shadowy Lady]

Noelle - thank you for the laugh, it totally made my day...that and the 30 mins nap I had just now. It's been a while since I had napped.

Hoping we all get some sleep tonight ladies. We're going away for the weekend and I'm already obsessing about not sleeping then :/

 

[Noelle610]

Wow, last night was horrendous. It was worse than having a newborn. It was probably also worse than the night Charlotte was sick, because she's on antibotics and I know she's feeling better - she's been the happiest, smiliest kid the past two days. I have no idea what is going on, but I suspect there could be a link to being off her routine last week and poor naps at daycare. C usually takes at least two 90 minutes naps, but yesterday she only napped for 35 minutes and 50 minutes all day.

She went down super quickly because she was exhausted. Beginning of the night was fine. DH did a dream feed around 10:30pm and she didn't wake earlier than that. Then the trouble started. She was up at midnight for an entire hour. I tried feeding even though I want to go back to the night weaning, as she's eating more during theday and feeling better now. She wouldn't even take it - rare for her at night. She went back to sleep around 1am and then was up... at 2am. I almost killed myself. She was up for another hour. I didn't try to feed her, just soothe, and nothing worked. I thought for sure I could at least get a couple hours of sleep at that point, but no. She woke again around 4:30am. At this point I decided to be up for the day. I am miserable this morning.

I'm ashamed to admit at one point I had to put Charlotte in her crib while she was crying and take the dog out for a walk. I couldn't take it anymore. It got to the point where my DH just wanted to let her CIO, but I wasn't comfortable with that. She's been sick and was acting very unusually for her - even when she wakes often she usually goes back to sleep quickly if I rock or feed her. So I just wasn't comfortable with crying. DH and I got into a huge fight since he wanted to let her cry and I wanted to soothe her, but he refused to help soothe since he didn't agree with my approach. I think we were both just EXHAUSTED. I'm really not against sleep training, but I think the kid has to be healthy and both parties have to be on board. I don't think it's wise to choose to sleep train out of desperation at 3am.

I'm just really hoping last night was a one off. How does a baby go from STTN to sleeping like that in the course of a week?

 

[MrsPear]

Aww Noelle, sorry you had such a rough night. An early morning after a night like that is awful!

Joni didn't sleep brilliantly either, but not as bad as that. She went to bed at 6:30, woke at 7:30 (30 minutes), 10:00 (30 minutes), 12:00 (30 minutes), 4:30 (still very sleepy but wouldn't be put down after that). I ended up sleeping in her room with her and she did actually have a lie in until 8am but I was so uncomfy sat up with her so I didn't get any sleep after that. I wonder if she might still be teething? In a way I hope so, I want her to get all her bloody teeth out so we can relax!

eta- i'm not sure why babies sleep well then not well all of a sudden, so I hope it's a one off for you, but maybe when you finally manage to night wean again she will respond like she did before? Having an infection may have just knocked her out of routine and you might be able to get it back soon. Hope so anyway.

 

[Noelle610]

eta- i'm not sure why babies sleep well then not well all of a sudden, so I hope it's a one off for you, but maybe when you finally manage to night wean again she will respond like she did before? Having an infection may have just knocked her out of routine and you might be able to get it back soon. Hope so anyway.

I really hope we can get back to where we were last week. I'm just so exhausted at having to keep working at this. Why does it come so naturally for some?

 

[jessicatunnel]

Noelle, looks like I'm not the only one who got in a fight with dh last night. :/ sorry your night was so rough, it must be so frustrating!

Well we had a pretty good night last night. Except for the fact that DH ROYALLY pissed me off. I get so excited when he gets home from work because I just miss him so much, and yesterday was no exception. I'm feeling pretty sick lately, and he comes home, everything was good, then he tells me he invited his whole platoon (like 15 guys PLUS their wives) to our house this weekend. Without even running it by me! Well that just instantly pissed me off. I'm getting sick, my baby has been ultra clingy, and the last think I want to deal with is 15 guys getting wasted in my back yard waking my baby up. I was pretty annoyed the rest of the night and he went to bed early.
I got Lilly down to bed at 630, and she woke up at 1030 as I was going to bed. She wasn't actually crying so i left her. She was doing that whaaaaaaa, pause, whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, pause, whaaaaaa, stop cry. She settled herself in four minutes. I'm not against sleep training at all but we don't do it in my house. If she's just fussing I will leave her, if she cries I will go get her. At 230am she woke up doing that same cry she did earlier so I left her again. Dh woke up this time and asked if I could hear her. I told him yes I'm leaving her for a few minutes. He then proceeds to get up to go to her room, I grabbed his arm and said "she's not crying, give her a chance to settle herself!" At which point she completely stopped crying. He continued to get up and told me he was going to check on her and I told him not to, and he said "what if something is wrong?!" And looked at me like I was the worst mother in the world. He got up and went into her room, she still wasn't crying, and then... She woke up and started crying!!!!!! Ughhhhhhh, I got a bottle ready and when dh came back in our room I said, "good job. I think its best if you get your stuff and sleep downstairs for the rest of the night." I fed her, came back to our room and he was gone. I went back to sleep and she woke at 6am and went back to sleep herself until 830am.

So for her it was a great night, for me and dh it was a horrible night. He's never slept away from me, and we didnt even see each other this morning. I'm sure I overreacted, I know I did, but I was just soooo annoyed by him for hours already.

Now my throat is killing me and I don't want to get Lilly sick so she's playing on the floor and im dreading when she starts getting grumpy and wanting me to hold her. And all this a week before we go home for Christmas holiday!!

Wow. Sorry about the novel. It was more about me then Lilly! I think I just needed to get it off my chest.

 

[Shadowy Lady]

Noelle - i'm sorry you had an off night. I do agree with your approach on sleep training though. It will def not work on a sick kid. Charlotte will be back to herself when she feels better I just know it!

Joni - good luck with the teething. I hear that if it affects them a lot in the early months it's much better when they get the rest of their teeth so there's hope

I was so exhausted with my poor night sleep that DH sent me downstairs last night and took charge. I love him so much for doing that even though it was the middle of the week. Sofia went down at 8:30 pm and my DH tells me she didn't wake up till 4:20 am for her feed!!! And then down again till 8:00 am.

Funny how she always sleeps better when DH is in charge. Maybe he should always be the night feeding person lol!