Rant - Feeling so hopeless about sleep!

[Noelle610]

Hey ladies!

Bananaz, my heart goes out to you - I know how hopeless it feels to backslide. That's why I started this thread! Have you considered the often-considered taboo of sleep training to deal with that first waking? I do think that both Elsie and Charlotte should be able to go 6 or 7 hours without eating at the beginning of the night, since they are healthy and solids have been established. I'm not sure how you feel about it, but just a thought since I know you've exhausted many options.

Boo, I completely understand how you feel! I am prone to anxiety and not quite a "go with the flow" type of girl myself, so I am right there with you in terms of stressing over the uncertainty. Unfortunately I've had to accept that it's always something with these babies and even the most consistent kids go through weird phases. We dealt with that early morning waking for quite some time and what helped was actually putting Charlotte to bed earlier. It seems counter-intuitive, but I truly believe Dr. Weissbluth's saying of "early to bed, LATE to rise". It continues to be true for us. C went to bed an hour late on Christmas eve and I was sure she would sleep late, but she actually woke super early! My other thought is, how much daytime sleep is your LO getting? Sometimes early wakings can be a sign that they're ready to drop a nap.

Shadowy Lady, glad to hear that the night weaning is going well. I am sorry you are not sleeping. I too think I developed a phobia of night time and was feeling so physically awful that it was making it hard for me to function. I must admit to try everything from melatonin to benadryl to meditation and nothing worked. What finally worked was just drugs. I am very much a natural person and hate to turn to medication, but after sleeping well (I mean, as well as you can with a baby) for a week now I feel like a new person. I highly recommend chatting with your doctor again.

Nights have been good here since that darn tooth popped through. Charlotte woke once last night around the 2:30am mark, screaming, from what I think was teething pain. There's a second popping up, but my mom friends tell me it's never as bad as the first. I cuddled her momentarily and she then slept through the rest of the night. I'm just going to enjoy this good sleep while it lasts, because I know it won't. She is trying SO HARD to crawl right now and she's super sensitive to developmental milestones, so I'm sure we're in for some crazy nights soon enough.

 

[libbylou]

Jumping into this thread with you ladies

LO has never been a good sleeper.
She was a terrible sleeper from birth to 8 weeks...started to improve and was consistently giving me 3-5 hour stretches at that time
Then the sleep regression hit at 13 weeks. She wouldn't nap, naps were short when they did happen, it took hours trying to rock/nurse her to sleep at night and she would wake up pretty much every single light sleep cycle (every 45-60 mins).
We started cosleeping almost full time to deal with this as she slept way better when in bed with us as she just nursed all night long
Did sleep training (camping out/modified CC) at 6 months and it was amazing! She started going to sleep easily at the start of the night (which luckily still continues), napping well (sometimes she still naps well, sometimes she doesn't) and sleeping 4-6 hours at a time. I seriously felt like a new person after two weeks of this!

And then she got her two front teeth
And a cold
And an ear infection
And then she seems to have developed separation anxiety or is going through some developmental stuff or something

Right now she's been fighting her naps for the past couple of days and night sleep has sucked for the last 6 weeks.
She's sleeping 1.5-2 hours for her first stretch and then up every hour beyond. She is restless when we take her into bed with us so I end up getting a crap sleep even when we cosleep.
We've even had quite a few nights where she flat out refuses to settle and just cries for 2-3 hours which has never happened before, she's always been really easy to get back to sleep in the middle of the night.
We've been playing a lot of musical beds...she starts the night in her crib and then whenever she refuses to settle in her crib after a waking, she comes to bed with us...then when she gets really restless in bed with us she goes back to her crib...and then back into bed with us when she won't settle in her crib anymore

Cosleeping is really the only way I am coping right now...except I have major issues with my hips and back and cosleeping is wreaking even more havoc on my poor body and the lack of sleep and constant barrage of broken sleep is really screwing with my anxiety and PPD issues too.

 

[Aimee1003]

I am still here ...mostly stalking the thread but last night was bad. Bed at 7:30. Up at 11:45. Down at 12:15. Up at 2:15.Cried and woke up everytime I laid him down (very unusual) . Finally asleep at 4:15. Up at 5. Down at 6:15. Up at 7:30! What the hell!!!

I have given up hope he will ever sttn again. Ever since wonder week 19 it has been tough. Good thing he is an easy baby otherwise!

 

[Noelle610]

Libby, the same thing happened to us! Sleep was going so well and then we had the cold/ear infection/teething trifecta and it totally messed things up. We seem to be getting back on track (touch wood), but it always seems to be something, doesn't it?

Aimee, that sounds brutal, I am so sorry! Those long night wakings are the worst.

 

[bananaz]

Noelle - I'm not averse to sleep training and we've done a little before, I'm just never sure if it's the right move. But I don't think she's teething or sick right now, and I definitely don't think she actually needs to be eating at 11:30, so if the current trend continues CC may definitely be in our future.

libby - That is so tough I remember how well you were doing with the CC, I'm sorry to hear it's gotten bad again. Elsie has also started having periods of screaming and refusing to settle in the middle of the night, as have many other babies around the same age on this thread, so I'm wondering if it's a developmental thing?

Aimee - Ughh horrible! That sounds very similar to how our nights have been lately.

 

[lysh]

Ladies....you are not giving me hope for the 6-7 month mark! lol LO had a bad few nights....Christmas was overly stimulating as we had a lot of people over so it threw her off. Last night she was back to 3-3 1/2 hour stretches (which for her I consider a good night). Her front two bottom teeth are out, so hopefully there is a break until her top teeth start coming in.

Libby- Sorry for the backslide! It is so hard-cosleeping killed my back and hips and baby girl is way too active!!I hope this calms down soon....have you bothered trying CC again? I find after going through that I have a hard time finding the heart/energy to go through it again!

Baby girl is wanting attention lol....have to go attend

 

[Shadowy Lady]

Libby - aaaaah man...I'm now worried about the future :/ Hope you guys get back on track soon.

Aimee - there's another wonder week at week 19? Damn it! These babies are in one of these wonder weeks all the time, aren't they?

Noelle - I'm a natural kinda person too. I'm not one to pop a pill as soon as I have a headache or am sick. I even did a fully natural labour and birth with Sofia. However, the sleep deprivation is so tough on me I'm willing to give medication a chance.

Things with Sofia's sleep are still improving thankfully. We put her to bed at 7:30 pm (instead of her usual 8:00 pm) and she slept till 2 am when she needed a feed. Then she slept again till 6:30 am when I fed her. It's 9:00 am now and she is asleep. I gotta say hats off to doctor Ferber both his sleep association and night weaning have worked great for us.

On the other hand I'm still sleeping very poorly Damn snow trucks came in at 2 am to move the loads and loads of snow we got and were in the streets till 4:30 am. They were SO loud, beeping as they moved ughhhhhh i got no sleep in that time frame. Sometimes I hate living in this %$#&'ing country

 

[bananaz]

lysh - I'm glad your LO is starting to settle back into better habits. I really hope she starts giving you longer than 3.5 hour stretches though!

Shadowy Lady - Wow, that sounds like a great night. How did you implement the night weaning and sleep association training? Did you pick specific wakings to try and eliminate or did you just tackle the whole night at once?


Last night was better for us. LO had the same pattern of wakings (11:30 and 2:30) but she put herself back to sleep within 5 minutes at the 11:30 one and then she didn't get up for the day until 6 instead of 5:30 like yesterday. So all in all not too bad, though I was up a lot with stupid hot flashes. I think I need to go see a GYN, I'm guessing it's not normal to still be getting hot flashes 7 months postpartum??

Also, I'm curious, what time do you ladies usually go to bed yourselves? Right now LO goes to bed at 6:30 but for some reason I can't get myself to go to sleep earlier than 9, so I'm missing out on 2.5 hours of potential sleep every night. I bet if I was able to go to sleep at 7 or 7:30 once in a while that would really help.

 

[lysh]

Bananaz- LO falls asleep between 6:30-7. Same here...I usually go to bed 8:30-9. I can't go to bed earlier during the work week though....only time I have to get anything done (which is hard because I am exhausted by evening).

LO is currently fighting me on putting her in her crib for her nap this morning. We are going to a friends for lunch so I am sitting here holding her so she will hopefully be in a good mood for lunch. Some days she lets me put her down no problem and other days it is a fight! When I am working, poor DH cannot get her to nap at all in the morning unless she cries in her crib for 5-10 minutes. It is wearing on him.

 

[Shadowy Lady]

Bananaz - I went pretty much by Ferber's book Chapters 4 (sleep association) and then 7 (night weaning).

We first eliminated the use of soother for night time based on Chapt 4. I put Sofia down awake and drowsy, leave and wait the intervals of 1, 3, and 5 mins before going in. It worked after only 3 nights. If she woke up in the middle of the night and wasn't hungry, I repeated the same step. Then after the 4-month sleep regression hit and suffering for 10 days, we implemented Chapt 7. The goal was to add 30 mins to time intervals between feed every night. We started at 3 hour interval and are now on 5 hour. Her first feed is at 2 am (moved from 11 pm) and her second one at 6:30 am (moved from 4 am). So pretty much we're back to one feed per night when the sleep regression had brought us up to 4 feeds!!!

I found both chapters fairly simple to use and I still don't see how Ferber has such a bad rep. His method works and we barely had any crying, just some fussing. She's also a much happier child now

Also, to answer your question about bedtime, mine is sooo messed up. I try to go to sleep at 9 pm but most of the time I don't fall asleep till like 11 pm :/ ughhh this is why I'm the issue and not Sofia

 

[maidelyn]

What age can you start sleep training? My LO is only 7wks so I don't want to start something too early but I'd also like some sleep!! Most of the time he'll do one stretch of 3-5hrs (from midnight usually) and then a couple more hours but the biggest problem is getting him off to sleep.... he fights it so much it can take an hour or two although I'm wondering whether that's because he's awake too long. Today for instance he's only had a couple of 30min naps since 0930 until we took him out for a drive at 1730 to try and get him to sleep.

 

[Shadowy Lady]

maidelyn - Def too early now...I've read a lot of sleep books and they may all be different but they agree on one thing. You cannot sleep train a newborn. They will not learn the pattern that early and they do need to eat every 3-4 hours. 5 Hours is the max you can get outta them. It will pass just hang in there.

We started at 3.5 months and that was just eliminating the soother. We started night weaning this week at 4 months. But even so I will still feed her once a night, I don't want to completely wean her off as she's young.

 

[maidelyn]

Yeah the night feed doesn't worry me so much but it's the getting him to sleep that's such hard work!

 

[lysh]

Maidelyn- I would hang in there a little longer and just keep working on a bedtime routine. By sticking to the same bedtime routine my LO eventually went to sleep much easier. She still wakes up a whole lot, but usually goes down within a half hour (that includes nursing time).

 

[Noelle610]

What age can you start sleep training? My LO is only 7wks so I don't want to start something too early but I'd also like some sleep!! Most of the time he'll do one stretch of 3-5hrs (from midnight usually) and then a couple more hours but the biggest problem is getting him off to sleep.... he fights it so much it can take an hour or two although I'm wondering whether that's because he's awake too long. Today for instance he's only had a couple of 30min naps since 0930 until we took him out for a drive at 1730 to try and get him to sleep.

He's too young right now It actually sounds like he is doing great for 7 weeks! A stretch of 3-5 hours is beautiful. Charlotte was always hard to get to sleep, too, but that passes as they get older and you learn the "tricks" and their preferences. Do you have a swing? Do you swaddle? Both of those things helped us so much in the early days? I also used a Rock-n-Play Sleeper from Fisher Price, which was a life saver - it really cradles the baby so that they feel secure and safe, unlike a crib or even a moses basket that's flat and and spacious around the sides.

 

[maidelyn]

We use a swing when he won't settle in our arms/on the boob but don't swaddle. I've spent most of this afternoon trying to settle him and he's finally napping (walk in the pram at 1 - complete failure, nursing, then rocked him to sleep and put him in his cot and got a 30min nap, then rocked him for about 30mins and jut put him down in his pram in the hallway.....).

To top it off my SiL's friend has done contented little baby so I've had chapter and verse from the family today on how we should do that and OH has been agreeing enthusiastically....... it's basically controlled crying isn't it?

 

[Boo44]

Hi ladies I'm looking for some advice

LO had developed yet another cold/cough type illness since yesterday with high temps which has put him right off his food. When your LO hardly has any bed time bottle what do you do? Just leave over night as usual, or wake for a 'dream feed' at 11pm ish? I've not had this problem before! And don't really want to fall back into night feeding, as we haven't done that (touch wood) since 14 weeks. Obviously though because he's ill I don't want to do anything wrong!

Another q is - when LO isn't ill etc - I appreciated the advice re earlier bedtime in an attempt to eliminate his random but persistent early wakings but I've come across a problem! LO only really likes to have milk/food 4 hrs apart and doesn't really get hungry (is quite fussy with milk as I've posted about before).
Currently he has bottles and food around 7.30am, 11.30/12, 3.30pm and 7pm before a bed time around 7.30pm (often more like 8pm by the time he's asleep)

If that 3.30pm bottle is much later he has less at 7pm. I'm trying to make his bed time 7pm but I'm really struggling with bringing the bedtime bottle time earlier! Noelle I remember you said your LO is fussy too but you brought her bedtime forward - how did it affect her bottles?

As my LO doesn't usually have night feeds I may be more concerned than average re how much he takes....

 

[Aimee1003]

Coming off another bad night. He has quit going to sleep easily like he used to. Last week or so he cries when laid down drowsy. He used to just roll over and go to sleep. Bedtime is at 7:30 and I didn't get him down til 8:45. He woke up 3 times when I laid him down. That hasn't happened for months.

Then he woke up at 12, 2, 4, and up for day at 7:30. Each time he wakes up it takes 30- an hour to get him back down
. I am so glad I work in the school system and am off this last week and next otherwise I would be a mombie because I would have to get up at 6 am for work. Getting to sleep in with him to 7:30 really helps.

Anyone have any theories on why he is waking up so much??? He sttn until the 4 month sleep regression hit him (it hit late-5 months) . He started waking up 3-4 times a night for 6 weeks. Last 4 he was back down to 1 wakeup. Now since last Monday, he is back to 3-4. Could it be teething? I don't see any teeth buds...

 

[MiniKiwi]

Bananaz, Mia goes to sleep around 8pm these days and I'm asleep by midnight. A few months ago, I used to go to bed with her at 6:30pm


We've had so much inconsistency. The night before last we had four hours awake in the middle of the night and then last night she sttn She went to sleep at 8pm, woke at 11pm because OH and I were squealing about a huge spider in the house haha! Then I fed her and she slept until 6:30am. Amazing. Tonight is probably going to be another totally unpredictable night but at least we're home from visiting family now so can get back to a bit of a routine.

I hope you all had a lovely christmas!

 

[Shadowy Lady]

Boo - when my LO was sick last she slept more during the day and woke up more at night. I fed her each time as she was sick. She went back to normal once she recovered from the cold.

Aimee - I wish I knew! My LO is more or less consistent but she also hasnt gone back to the amazing sleeper she was before. Like sometimes she give me a 6 hours stretch some other times she's randomly up at like 11 pm :/ We're thinking of putting her to bed earlier (her current bed time is 7:45 pm).

Minikiwi - yay for sttn! Hope it becomes a regular pattern

I slept 10 straight hours last night as my DH was in charge of night feedings. I still don't feel amazing as my cold is pretty bad. I've lost my voice, ears hurt really bad and can't stop coughing. DH said Sofia was up at 2 am and then again at 7 am. I'm gonna take half of the night off tonight so hopefully I can be in better shape soon. Sofia looks a bit sick too so I need to have more energy to deal with that soon.

Hope you all have a great night.