Sensitive kids group

[Kel127]

Happy Birthday Megan!

 

[cutie4evr01]

Way to go on the potty training, Omar!

Happy birthday to Megan! I hope she had a fun party yesterday and a great birthday today!

 

[DaisyBee]

I'll write more tomorrow, just wanted to say thanks to all It was a wonderful weekend. Megan had so much fun.

And yay! Go Omar! Im glad its working Hun!

 

[OmarsMum]

Daisybee- glad you had a good weekend

I'm not sending Omar to daycare. I went there today to take a look. Non of the girls there are professionals, they all look like our housekeeper. They had 4 kids only, 2 of them who had been going there for a month were crying & they weren't dealing with them professionally. The place is a good size, so they should have taken then to another area away from the other two kids who were fine. I saw them carrying the kids & rocking them, instead of engaging them in something or distracting them

The kids are also way younger than Omar. I don't think it's the right place for us.

The supervisor wasn't there, according to SIL (her son started to go there two weeks back), the supervisor leaves the place a lot. SIL stays around a lot, but her situation is different that us, she lives with my parents in a crowded house & she can't afford to take her son to classes like we do, her son is easy going in general & he gets occupied with simple toys. The place is a walking distance from my parents place, but I have to use a car to reach there,

My nephew was sitting alone playing & watching Barney!

Omar needs stimulation & above his age activities & ongoing interaction.

I will not withdraw the registration money for the time being, but I will visit to have a talk with the supervisor, I will not enroll him until they have more structure & proper teachers.

 

[polaris]

Daisybee, I'm really pleased that the birthday weekend went well and that Megan enjoyed it. I really loved Thomas's third birthday, I think it was one of my favourite family parties ever, it was just really relaxed and he enjoyed himself so much and was so thrilled that this was all for him!

Omarsmum, that daycare doesn't sound ideal at all. I wouldn't be impressed at all to see a child sitting playing by himself and watching Barney. I think you are right that it won't suit Omar and definitely won't be of any benefit to him. I do think there is a lot of pressure to send children to daycare/preschool, but I always remind myself that when my generation were children it was really unusual to go to any form of preschool before starting school and we all managed fine. Having said that, I will send Thomas to preschool next September when he gets his free hours. I keep meaning to go back and have another look around the preschool, I did visit it when he was younger and liked it but I have more of an idea of what to look out for now.

 

[DaisyBee]

That sounds like a good decision about daycare. He doesn't have to go... So it doesn't need to be rushed to send him just anywhere. I've been on the search for classes around the area here and I've found a lot more in the bigger town near here. Some are very expensive and we could afford it I suppose, but why? There are quite a lot of activities that she could be in next fall as they have to be 3 by September to be in them ( which is the same as how preschool works here as well) so I'm wondering if maybe it would be an idea to send her to preschool for 2 days a week in the fall and then we do an activity on a 3rd day vs 3 days at preschool. Im trying to find out from her what sort of things she thinks would be fun and so far not much repsonse. There is an art class very near here I've found that I'm going to call and see the ages. It starts in January and it usually thursdays but also sporadic days, I don't know if you go every time or just individual weeks or what. They read a kids book and then do an art project based off the book. And the teacher is a professional artist. But the classes are 9am and 2pm which is basically jordans naps, lol of course! I found a music class about 20 mile drive away that looks nice and that's at 4-4:45. Im really considering that one. I need to find out more info though. It seems that some things started a new session in December and its too late to sign up. I assumed with holidays new sessions would start in January.

It was a busy weekend, and Megan needs a few days down time to recover. Lol she is a total grouch today, lots of meltdowns. I liked that she really understood that it was her birthday, we looked through pictures from when she was born and as a baby and she understood that it was her as a baby. I was very emotional all weekend thinking that she is already 3 and no longer a baby! Dh and I were very broody all weekend. Lol

Megan got very wound up after lots of sugar and excitement, which is to be expected. She didn't want to open all the presents and I had saved ours for last for that reason in case, so she opened those yesterday. We made "birthday soup" yesterday.

I got sick as well so all 4 of us are sick. Jordan also got her 3rd tooth over the weekend. So i haven't slept much, haha.

Inlaws gave Megan a toddler cookbook and a small cookie sheet, spatulas, spoons, rolling pin, etc. For her to use in the kitchen. She loves them... We are deciding what Xmas cookies to make and she is going to give some for presents from her to people for Xmas ( like grandparents, aunts and uncles, etc). She is very excited about that.

 

[Tacey]

The daycare sound dire, especially for Omar. Is there anywhere else around?

Hope you're all better soon Daisybee. The baking things sound like the perfect gift. Enjoy cookie baking!

I had a very interesting chat with MIL yesterday. She runs the preschool at a local primary. I tentatively mentioned that I had had some concerns about Alice, and had wondered if she was on the spectrum. To be honest, I thought she wouldn't give much credence to it, but she told me if Alice was in her class, she'd be in 'her' group, and down as having additional needs, with a potential red flag for getting outside support. She's been taking her to church, and has told me Alice's interaction with others in the children's group is unusual. I suppose this isn't news to me, just interesting to hear it from someone who I've not previously discussed it with. She was of the same opinion as me that at the moment, I can manage Alice's needs, I keep pushing her, but within limits she can cope with, so a formal diagnosis probably isn't necessary right now.

I am wondering if she's coming down with something. Tonight, we'd just finished dinner (at 4.30 ) and she was playing with Arthur, when she suddenly burst into hysterical tears, and could barely speak. She finally blurted out "I NEED to go to bed RIGHT NOW" so I took her upstairs, She was really sobbing through the whole bed time routine and fell asleep before I'd left the room. That was at 4.50! She really does understand her needs though. That's made a huge improvement for all our lives, as I really couldn't have guessed that was what had made her so upset!

 

[DaisyBee]

I find that so interesting that as a teacher your mil hasn't even said anything til now... And waited for you to bring it up! Lol my mil doesn't wait for me to ask her opinion - she gives it freely! It is good though that you both think Alice is handling things for now.

That really is amazing that she is willing to go to bed like that and realize that in herself. Even when tired Megan fights sleeping all the way to the bed even when exhausted. Poor girl - wonder what was going on?

Megan has been a mess. I don't know if it's from her being sick or too big of weekend or what. She hasn't been herself the past 2 days. Meltdowns all the time, horrible time sleeping. Waking still totally exhausted. Being very moody and talking back. don't know what to do for her.

 

[Tacey]

Sorry things aren't good with Megan. It's probably a combination of everything you mentioned. I also remember as I child struggling after birthdays and Christmas, as you build up to something, then it's gone. Maybe there's a bit of that happening too. Whatever it is, I hope it doesn't last long

MIL is very aware of not wanting to step on my toes, so she offers lots of support, nut never advice. She's a DIL's dream! It's reassured me that she thinks we're doing a decent job, as she would speak up if she thought Alice wasn't getting what she needed. To be honest, there's a lot of similarities between her and Alice anyway, so maybe she understands!

 

[OmarsMum]

Hi ladies, I'm a bit busy, will look into posts & comment later, but I'm interested to know more about the concerns regarding Alice. What are the issues your SIL noticed that require special Attention / needs? What does she mean when she told you "Alice's interaction with others in the children's group is unusual"?

 

[Tacey]

Hi ladies, I'm a bit busy, will look into posts & comment later, but I'm interested to know more about the concerns regarding Alice. What are the issues your SIL noticed that require special Attention / needs? What does she mean when she told you "Alice's interaction with others in the children's group is unusual"?

Her concern in a nursery setting would be about how she interacts with others. She is very single minded, and can't stand anyone doing anything in a different way. She can't play with other children, which is pretty standard for a 3 year old I guess, but the extreme anger is a red flag. She also will just point blank refuse to do what adults tell her if she doesn't want to do it. Her sensitivity to sound is an issue in a group setting too.

 

[polaris]

Tacey, your MIL sounds great, I really hope I can be that type of MIL one day who can offer support without interference! It sounds like she has similar concerns to what you have already identified but I do think it can feel a bit different hearing it from somebody else rather than just thinking it, hope you are OK about it all, you are definitely doing a fab job with both children so there are definitely no worries on that front.

Daisybee, Thomas got really sick immediately after his birthday and wasn't right for weeks. I do think it was partly all of the excitement contributed to his whole system being a bit dysregulated. Really hope that Megan gets back to herself soon. She probably just needs some down-time but I agree with Tacey that there's also maybe that sense of all the anticipation and the build-up and then it's over. Thomas wanted another birthday after his birthday, he kept asking for "one last birthday".

 

[OmarsMum]

Hi ladies, I'm a bit busy, will look into posts & comment later, but I'm interested to know more about the concerns regarding Alice. What are the issues your SIL noticed that require special Attention / needs? What does she mean when she told you "Alice's interaction with others in the children's group is unusual"?

Her concern in a nursery setting would be about how she interacts with others. She is very single minded, and can't stand anyone doing anything in a different way. She can't play with other children, which is pretty standard for a 3 year old I guess, but the extreme anger is a red flag. She also will just point blank refuse to do what adults tell her if she doesn't want to do it. Her sensitivity to sound is an issue in a group setting too.

Thanks Hun. Kids who attend classes with Omar interact with each other but they are only 3 kids & they attend the nursery program together 5 days a week since last year. So they are used to be around each other.

But Omar doesn't really interact with them, but he interacts with kids he's familiar with like my nephew & his cousins. Does she see any kids on regular basis?

He also interacts with adults, & he seeks the attention of older kids. He's getting better with sharing & group activities but again we've been going forever so now he's comfortable with interacting & socializing.

As you mentioned earlier, Alice spends a lot of time playing alone (unlike Omar who asks for ongoing attention).

I think the over all environment has an impact on their behaviour, I'm no expert. But I'm trying to figure out why Omar doesn't feel comfy to play alone but Alice prefers to stay on her own.

When Omar was very young, we never left him alone in a room, we were living in a full house with my brothers, parents & the housekeeper, so he always had someone around talking to & playing with him. He was never left alone in a room to play or to watch TV, this is why now he can't sit alone to play as he's not used to it & it's not the norm for him.

We also go out alomost everyday & he used to love going out, but during Ramadan (when we were fasting in July- August) , we didn't do any activities & we used to stay at home a lot, then we had a tragic death in our family, then my parents moved to a new house a bit far away from our place, & during their move we were stuck at home, so basically from July till November we were at home almost everyday, so staying at home with no interactions with any kids became the norm.

When we started to go out more & we registered in classes again, it was a shock to his system, & he started to resist going out as he was ok at home & he was having fun there.

Again, he resists activities when we go to classes for a reason, he has it all at home. We play with paint, playdoh, we have a trampoline, we colour on the floor, etc. so for him the activities in classes are not really excited. He interacts in the soccer class as it's something new & we don't do it at home, we don't ask him to pass or kick a ball to score.

When we grew up, we were around loads of family & neighbors, so it's totally different than the environment around Omar. My parents didn't send us to nurseries, took us to classes or looked for people online to get us friends, we had friends by default.

Sorry, I'm rambling here, but I do think socializing at a very early age really affect their social skills while they're growing up. I found that kids who join nurseries / daycare early or those who are raised around many kids, don't usually struggle socially or when they join pre-school unlike those who don't interact with kids on daily basis.

 

[Kel127]

Daisybee- I'm not looking forward to Connor's birthday for that reason. He is a mess for days after going to someone else's party, so I can't imagine what it will be like after his. For 3 days after Halloween he would stand at the front door with his bucket in hysterics because he wanted to go trick or treating again. You asked about Connor's tics. They are mostly random but become more frequent when he is tired or excited.

Tacey- Connor is the same way with being single minded and not good with interacting with others. He becomes very angry if you try to change his task or if someone tries to play with him. We used to go to a play group that had many activity stations. He would only play with the trains for the whole hour every week. I have had many family members suggest that he is on the spectrum, but I feel he is to young to be labeled yet.

Omarsmom- It sounds like you made the right decisions abut the daycare. I would never leave Connor somewhere like that either.

Connor's neurologist suggested that we start Connor in occupational therapy. I have been putting it off, but his behavior seems to becoming worse. I don't know what to do.

 

[Kel127]

Omarsmom- I'm not sure if I agree with you last statement when it comes to Connor. I have been back to work full time since Connor was 6 weeks old. He has been going to my friends house twice a week since he was 4 months, and still screams when I drop him off. He still rarely plays and interacts with her daughter even though they have grown up together. When he is home he will ask about her and say he wants to play with her. He also went to daycare for 3 times a week for 6 months, and never played with anyone or joined in.
I have a friend with triplets that he has grown up with and he calls them all by name and talks about them but usually plays independently when we are with them. He doesn't like or play with his sister either

 

[Tacey]

Thanks Polaris! It was almost a shock hearing her say it, even though it's not new to me. I think it's helped though, and made me feel we're going in the right direction.

Omarsmum, yes, Alice is often around other children. I've got a lovely friendship group whose children Alice has grown up with, including her cousin. We see everyone weekly, but if you ask her about them, she'll give a detailed list of reasons why none of them are her friends From being tiny, we went to classes, soft play, and just to friends houses. She's always struggled, but it actually became more obvious when we were doing more. I agree that a rich social life helps most children develop social skills, which is why I think there may be an underlying issue. Socialising seems to make her less social!

I'm not sure about the playing alone thing. As a baby I could never put Alice down. I babywore almost 24/7, because she needed to be physically touching me. Just before she was 2, I started noticing she was needing that less. It was about then that she stopped giving kisses. She started hiding under blankets when upset. It gradually developed that she'd go away from everyone for longer and longer periods, especially when she's under stress.

Kel - We've been in the same place with focussing on one thing at toddler groups. We went to one three weeks running. It was superbly resourced, and not overcrowded... She rode up and down on a tricycle for the full 2 hours every single week! Sorry to be dim, but what does occupational therapy involve? for going through a difficult time. It's awful not knowing what to do for the best.

 

[DaisyBee]

I do see what you are saying omarsmum, but I do think a lot of it comes down to personality of the child. Megan is around less kids than most and yet she is very social in small group settings or one on one. We had a playdate this past summer with a brother and sister that she hadn't had a playdate with before. She played very will with them. The other girl and her interacted and had a tea party. And yet another family with a boy and girl she didn't do well with at all. The boy was too over the top for her and she got overstimulated as did jordan, and by the time they left both of my kids were just out of sorts. Jordan was crying and Megan was insane. Our older neighbor kids she will grab their hand and say come on, let's go play. At soft play she runs around with the other kids about age 3-4.

As far as the playing alone I do think some of it is what they are used to, but not always. Megan will go off and play for a bit... Like this morning she was catching fish in her room and she would be in there for 3-4 minutes and then come give me a pretend fish, say a few things about the fishing, and then go off and play for another minute. Back and forth. Eventually she wanted me to come see the train (pretend) in her room and play with her. She is playing better lately... After Jordan was born she was much clingier.


Yesterday we had the biggest meltdown in public that we've had in a long time. I decided that we needed to get out of the house and maybe it would help her. She was giggly throughout the store and noticing and commenting on everything that she saw ( which of course was everything in the whole store!) by the end I could tell she was having issues and yet we hadn't been there THAT long. She melted down as we were trying to leave as she wanted to push the cart out to the car which isn't doable with me carrying Jordan in her carseat carrier as well. She had the meltdown about the cart, but it was obvious to me she was just overstimulated. I tried calming her down but it wasn't working so then I got her just to take my hand and she cried all the way to the car. Once in the car she then cried and cried as claiming she was cold. Well it was chilly but not that cold. She was just overwhelmed and it was something to be upset over. It continued like that all the way home and in the house, upset over anything she could think of. She yawned and said she was tired at that point. Well we hadn't had dinner yet and I was trying to get food ready while getting her calm as thought I needed to get her fed ASAP as well. She was messy during dinner on purpose, just not listening, whiny, etc. I was realizing last night how well she has been doing recently. She hasn't been majorly melting down or overstimulated much until the past few days when it's been this constant overaroused state. It's been from when she first wakes til she falls asleep she has been not at baseline since her bday. I can't figure out what I can do to get her back to baseline.

It's my bday today! My mom called and now I'm in a horrible mood. Trying to forget about it so I don't wreck my day. She is back to her old tricks and reminds me a bit of what you talk about omarsmum with your mom. Frustrating!

 

[Kel127]

Tacey- Here is a little fact sheet about occupational therapy - https://www.aota.org/Consumers/Professionals/WhatIsOT/CY/Fact-Sheets/Children.aspx

Daisybee- Happy Birthday I hope you have a great day despite your mom trying to wreck it.

 

[Tacey]

Sorry to hear about the meltdown and the crappy conversation with your mum. we have the same thing when Alice is upset and then will cry about any tiny thing, no matter how seemingly ridiculous. It sounds like you handled it brilliantly though. Hope Megan is back at her baseline soon. Most importantly, a very happy birthday!

Kel, thanks for the fact sheet. That's really interesting. It sounds like a very practical way of helping with day to day routines. Have you decided whether to go for it or not yet?

 

[polaris]

Hi everyone!

Happy birthday Daisybee! I hope you enjoy the rest of the day. I guess Megan will maybe take a bit longer to unwind and get back to normal after all the excitement. And then we will have Christmas!

I'm not sure about the importance of socializing from an early age. Part of the reason why Thomas is not in preschool is that I don't really feel that he is ready for it from a social perspective. I think that he would just find it stressful rather than benefiting from it. As he's getting older his social skills are improving and I'm hopeful that he will be better able to cope with it when he starts next September. I think some children are naturally sociable whether or not they attend daycare or have much exposure to other children. I think these naturally sociable children tend to cope well with daycare/preschool/toddler groups/etc. from an early age, whereas others just take a bit longer to develop their social skills. At three months, Clara is much more sociable than Thomas was at the same age. She has loads of pre-verbal skills and will hold a full "conversation" with you with facial expressions, head movements, eye contact, smiles, etc. which Thomas never really did in quite the same way even when he was older.