Short Luteal Phase?

[StarSign]

I did take soy for my last two cycles in the hope of extending my 9 day luteal phase and getting my BFP!

Unfortunately it did nothing for my luteal phase or getting my BFP..

I did feel ovulation on the first cycle - which I don't normally - but that was about it...

However my second cycle on soy - I think ovulated very late in cycle (clearblue monitor gave me a peak) and then my temperatures never rised afterwards - so not sure what was going on.

Don't think I would try soy again.....

Starsign - I did try Vitex but only for 2 months - so maybe I need to use it for a more prolonged period of time / + increasing dosage...

Yeah, I would try increasing dosage and taking the dose on an empty tummy. For some- it can take up to 3 months to see effect. For me, I felt it first cycle, but I was on my optimal dosage. What dose were you on before?

*SS*

 

[googly]

Hi guys, I posted this in another thread, but thought it might be useful for some here as well. I went to a FS today about my short (7-9 days) LP - my GP reluctantly referred me, despite not thinking it was much of a problem!

I'm glad I forced the issue because the FS said I was definitely right to come and see him when I did because no, I would NOT get pregnant with a 7-9 day LP. He did an ultrasound to check the internals - uterus looks fine, left ovary fine with good follicles, right ovary "a touch polycystic looking", but nothing major. All other bloods fine, except CD21 progesterone level is good enough to prove ovulation, but too low to support a good length LP (obviously). He said he doesn't immediately know what would be causing the short LP - maybe something to do with follicle development, maybe a couple of other factors... but basically they all end with Clomid treatment. So that's what he's recommended.

I will take that for 3 cycles unmonitored, except for doing CD21 bloods to check progesterone (wanting to see an increase each time). After that we'll re-assess, possibly up the dosage, do some more tests (e.g. checking the tubes) and maybe do some FSH treatments. He's also ordered more bloods to check FSH, prolactin, and AMH, but he thinks they should be fine).

Also said if I do get pregnant to go in straight away and get early pregnancy monitoring, esp. re. progesterone.

All in all, I feel pretty good that a) someone agrees with me that my LP is a problem, and b) that I'm doing something about it now. I would definitely recommend all those with this issue to force an appt with a FS asap...

 

[NorthStar]

Brilliant, I already posted my congrats in finding a good FS in the other thread but it must be a massive relief.

With the Clomid you might want to invest in the cough syrip to counteract the drying effects on CM?

 

[googly]

Brilliant, I already posted my congrats in finding a good FS in the other thread but it must be a massive relief.

With the Clomid you might want to invest in the cough syrip to counteract the drying effects on CM?

Got it on the way home!

One thing I am going to have to watch on clomid though, is that it can apparently sometimes reduce your endometrial layer - and I already have VERY light periods... But he said to just see how we go for 3 months and then we could re-assess/do more tests, which could include that endometrial biopsy thing that some people have.

So they seem to prefer a stepped approach before escalating too much - but I'm fine with that at this stage - especially from a financial POV!

 

[NorthStar]

Ok well you're good to go now then, fab news.

Hopefully the Clomid does the trick for you, I've heard people say it lengthens their LP.

 

[LancyLass]

Hi guys, I posted this in another thread, but thought it might be useful for some here as well. I went to a FS today about my short (7-9 days) LP - my GP reluctantly referred me, despite not thinking it was much of a problem!

I'm glad I forced the issue because the FS said I was definitely right to come and see him when I did because no, I would NOT get pregnant with a 7-9 day LP. He did an ultrasound to check the internals - uterus looks fine, left ovary fine with good follicles, right ovary "a touch polycystic looking", but nothing major. All other bloods fine, except CD21 progesterone level is good enough to prove ovulation, but too low to support a good length LP (obviously). He said he doesn't immediately know what would be causing the short LP - maybe something to do with follicle development, maybe a couple of other factors... but basically they all end with Clomid treatment. So that's what he's recommended.

I will take that for 3 cycles unmonitored, except for doing CD21 bloods to check progesterone (wanting to see an increase each time). After that we'll re-assess, possibly up the dosage, do some more tests (e.g. checking the tubes) and maybe do some FSH treatments. He's also ordered more bloods to check FSH, prolactin, and AMH, but he thinks they should be fine).

Also said if I do get pregnant to go in straight away and get early pregnancy monitoring, esp. re. progesterone.

All in all, I feel pretty good that a) someone agrees with me that my LP is a problem, and b) that I'm doing something about it now. I would definitely recommend all those with this issue to force an appt with a FS asap...

Brilliant, I already posted my congrats in finding a good FS in the other thread but it must be a massive relief.

With the Clomid you might want to invest in the cough syrip to counteract the drying effects on CM?

Got it on the way home!

One thing I am going to have to watch on clomid though, is that it can apparently sometimes reduce your endometrial layer - and I already have VERY light periods... But he said to just see how we go for 3 months and then we could re-assess/do more tests, which could include that endometrial biopsy thing that some people have.

So they seem to prefer a stepped approach before escalating too much - but I'm fine with that at this stage - especially from a financial POV!

Great news for you. Looks like I'm going to have to start pushing it with the GP too. How long had you been trying before they agreed to refer you? Having said that, my GP already made noises about trying drugs (I think it was Clomid) so maybe I can get further with her than you did with yours.

Googly, you and I seem to be v similar - I think I have lightish periods too (although how do you know?! I mean you only ever experience your own periods so how do you know how it compares to everyone else??!) So the endometrial thing might be a prob for me too.

 

[greengerbera]

Googly - Really happy that you have had a successful FS appointment ...

Mine did not go so well (

The FS basically said the 9 day luteal phase was due to my age and there was not much he could do and ideally it should be 14 days ...

He said that my only option if pregnancy did not happen naturally was to go for IVF due to my age (40!) and that was it ..

I am so disappointed that I felt he just took one look at my notes - and looked at my age and wasn't going to progress it anymore - he did offer a dye test which I have accepted - just to see if any blockages - but I did not get an scan or anything which I was sort of expecting with the first appointment?

Came away really sad and fed up!

I am now wondering if I need to consider a private appointment rather than NHS (UK System) - who might give me more time considering I am a paying patient?

It is interesting that our two experiences have been very different - I would be really interested to follow you to see how you get on with the Clomid - I will keep all fingers and toes crossed for you that it works and that you see a extension to your luteal phase and a BFP!!

Starsign - Looks like I am starting the Vitex today .... What dosage would you suggest I take?

 

[LancyLass]

Googly - Really happy that you have had a successful FS appointment ...

Mine did not go so well (

The FS basically said the 9 day luteal phase was due to my age and there was not much he could do and ideally it should be 14 days ...

He said that my only option if pregnancy did not happen naturally was to go for IVF due to my age (40!) and that was it ..

I am so disappointed that I felt he just took one look at my notes - and looked at my age and wasn't going to progress it anymore - he did offer a dye test which I have accepted - just to see if any blockages - but I did not get an scan or anything which I was sort of expecting with the first appointment?

Came away really sad and fed up!

I am now wondering if I need to consider a private appointment rather than NHS (UK System) - who might give me more time considering I am a paying patient?

It is interesting that our two experiences have been very different - I would be really interested to follow you to see how you get on with the Clomid - I will keep all fingers and toes crossed for you that it works and that you see a extension to your luteal phase and a BFP!!

Starsign - Looks like I am starting the Vitex today .... What dosage would you suggest I take?

That sucks. So sorry. Do you mind me asking which hospital you went to? Same for you Googly? We're supposed to have "Patient Choice" on the NHS and can ask for any hospital you want when you're referred. So if I get to that stage, it'd be good to know which are the better hospitals rather than just going local. Thanks.

 

[greengerbera]

It was my local hospital - Hinchingbrooke in Huntingdon, Cambs

Which was obviously a bad choice...

 

[LancyLass]

It's amazing the different levels of service/knowledge you get at hospitals. I have a heart defect I have to get checked every couple of years. My local hospital cardiac consultant recently left so they had a locum in for my last appt. He was cr*p! I had to tell HIM the latest medical advice about something - which my previous two consultants had told me a few years ago. Utterly shocking as it means he's telling the wrong thing to all his other patients.

I know you're probably feeling deflated right now after your appt, but if you feel up for the fight you should check out your rights on the NHS about going for a second opinion.

 

[StarSign]

Googly - Really happy that you have had a successful FS appointment ...

Mine did not go so well (

The FS basically said the 9 day luteal phase was due to my age and there was not much he could do and ideally it should be 14 days ...

He said that my only option if pregnancy did not happen naturally was to go for IVF due to my age (40!) and that was it ..

I am so disappointed that I felt he just took one look at my notes - and looked at my age and wasn't going to progress it anymore - he did offer a dye test which I have accepted - just to see if any blockages - but I did not get an scan or anything which I was sort of expecting with the first appointment?

Came away really sad and fed up!

I am now wondering if I need to consider a private appointment rather than NHS (UK System) - who might give me more time considering I am a paying patient?

It is interesting that our two experiences have been very different - I would be really interested to follow you to see how you get on with the Clomid - I will keep all fingers and toes crossed for you that it works and that you see a extension to your luteal phase and a BFP!!

Starsign - Looks like I am starting the Vitex today .... What dosage would you suggest I take?

Hi Green'-

I would start out at 800mg on an empty tummy (either 30minutes b4 eating or 2hrs after) in the morning. Starting it as early in your cycle as possible gives your body more time to respond by the end of it. Here's to an immediate increase of 1-2 days this cycle.

Brilliant, I already posted my congrats in finding a good FS in the other thread but it must be a massive relief.

With the Clomid you might want to invest in the cough syrip to counteract the drying effects on CM?

Got it on the way home!

One thing I am going to have to watch on clomid though, is that it can apparently sometimes reduce your endometrial layer - and I already have VERY light periods... But he said to just see how we go for 3 months and then we could re-assess/do more tests, which could include that endometrial biopsy thing that some people have.

So they seem to prefer a stepped approach before escalating too much - but I'm fine with that at this stage - especially from a financial POV!

Thanks for posting your update. I'm glad you felt like someone in the medical field understood you! Another thing to help the uterine lining is Siberian Ginseng. It increases the health and blood flow there. It won't interfere with the Clomid and cough syrup.

to you.

 

[greengerbera]

Thanks Lancylass - your email has prompted me to question my appointment today!

So just sent a email off to the Department Nurse explaining my disappointment with the appointment and it also gave me the opportunity to restate my concerns with my luteal phase and questioned the possible use of clomid?

We will see if they respond... if not .. will just have to keep the HSG appointment and see if I can rebook to discuss the results of that and hopefully may get a different consultant that I can talk to?

Thanks again for the advice..

 

[LancyLass]

Thanks Lancylass - your email has prompted me to question my appointment today!

So just sent a email off to the Department Nurse explaining my disappointment with the appointment and it also gave me the opportunity to restate my concerns with my luteal phase and questioned the possible use of clomid?

We will see if they respond... if not .. will just have to keep the HSG appointment and see if I can rebook to discuss the results of that and hopefully may get a different consultant that I can talk to?

Thanks again for the advice..

Go for it girl!!!

 

[googly]

Great news for you. Looks like I'm going to have to start pushing it with the GP too. How long had you been trying before they agreed to refer you? Having said that, my GP already made noises about trying drugs (I think it was Clomid) so maybe I can get further with her than you did with yours.

Googly, you and I seem to be v similar - I think I have lightish periods too (although how do you know?! I mean you only ever experience your own periods so how do you know how it compares to everyone else??!) So the endometrial thing might be a prob for me too.

Ha, yeah I was thinking the same re. how do you know... but I explained to the doc (TMI ahead) that my periods amounted to maybe 2-3 tampons "worth" total... and it seems like the percentage of brown to red blood is somewhere around 75:25, so not much red blood at all. He agreed that was "light" !!

Re. how long trying, I came of the BCP at the beginning of Feb, didn't take much notice the first month, and have then had 6 cycles of what I think is 'well-timed' BD, i.e. I monitored and was pretty sure I knew when ov was, and usually got at least 2 BD in around the peak days.

My GP was happy enough to refer after that amount of time (possibly earlier actually), but it was more on the basis of age than anything else, as I've mentioned a few times (because I can't belieeeeeve it!) - she/they didn't see much problem with my LP! Pfffft.

I don't know whether GPs in the UK are willing to prescribe Clomid (or other clomiphene citrate - mine is actually 'Seraphene') but GPs here certainly aren't... and I don't know if I would want it from them anyway! I couldn't believe how little they knew. Seeing the FS, it was mostly just such a relief to talk to someone who knew what they were talking about.

Definitely force the issue one way or other... it sounds like we won't get far with our short or 'defect' LPs without a bit of help. Better to know that up front eh

 

[googly]

Googly - Really happy that you have had a successful FS appointment ...

Mine did not go so well (

The FS basically said the 9 day luteal phase was due to my age and there was not much he could do and ideally it should be 14 days ...

He said that my only option if pregnancy did not happen naturally was to go for IVF due to my age (40!) and that was it ..

I am so disappointed that I felt he just took one look at my notes - and looked at my age and wasn't going to progress it anymore - he did offer a dye test which I have accepted - just to see if any blockages - but I did not get an scan or anything which I was sort of expecting with the first appointment?

Came away really sad and fed up!

I am now wondering if I need to consider a private appointment rather than NHS (UK System) - who might give me more time considering I am a paying patient?

It is interesting that our two experiences have been very different - I would be really interested to follow you to see how you get on with the Clomid - I will keep all fingers and toes crossed for you that it works and that you see a extension to your luteal phase and a BFP!!

Starsign - Looks like I am starting the Vitex today .... What dosage would you suggest I take?

So sorry you didn't get progress ggb, that really sucks. I agree with the others about trying to get a second opinion, and/or going privately if that is an option... this guy I saw was essentially 'private' (I think all specialists are here) and it was totally worth the attention and expertise you get.

From what this guy told me, what they're telling you is bollocks - he suggested to me that there are lots of things we can try, Clomid is just the start -- that was one of the things that really encouraged me. I get the impression Clomid is the fertility 'wonder drug' they chuck at everyone first! But he seemed to have a 'path' in mind as well. And I don't think age closes those, not at 40 anyway!

Will definitely keep you posted on how I go with Clomid anyway... I'm starting on a very low dose, so I'm not necessarily expecting anything this month, but will bump it up next cycle. Still, will be interesting to see what it does to ov and LP...

FX for you... see what you can do about seeing another doc!! Might make all the difference

 

[googly]

That sucks. So sorry. Do you mind me asking which hospital you went to? Same for you Googly? We're supposed to have "Patient Choice" on the NHS and can ask for any hospital you want when you're referred. So if I get to that stage, it'd be good to know which are the better hospitals rather than just going local. Thanks.

I went to 'Fertility Associates', which I think is a private/public fertility clinic here in New Zealand. There is a points system (according to various things like age, health, previous children, time ttc, etc) whereby if you get enough points it is publicly funded... but until then, it's a fair bit of $$$. I think I qualify in a lot of areas - being over 35 bumps you up quite a bit - but I have to be on Clomid for 9 months before I fall into the publicly funded category. Then you qualify for subsidised/paid IUI and IVF.

So yeah, they were v. good... I was v. impressed with the doc, their approach... he was quite laid back about it, didn't seem to be ordering any unnecessary tests, and minimising the amount of appointments I would need - which I appreciate from a financial POV! So glad I went.

If either of you are anywhere near Warwickshire I can recommend an awesome endocrinologist - my Dad! he's at Warwick Hospital.

(not that I've talked to him about our TTC - noooooo way, never but he does always like to joke about how many women he's got pregnant, haha... professionally speaking of course)

It does seem like an endocrinologist is the type you want if you have hormone related issues... which seems like is primarily the case with LP defect (progesterone and/or FSH issues).

I would seriously keep trying docs until you get someone good ... there seems to be a such a wide variation in advice. Who knows if this clomid is going to work for me, but I at least want to TRY.

 

[googly]

Thanks for posting your update. I'm glad you felt like someone in the medical field understood you! Another thing to help the uterine lining is Siberian Ginseng. It increases the health and blood flow there. It won't interfere with the Clomid and cough syrup.

to you.

Hey thanks, I will definitely try that out... I'm also doing acupuncture, hoping that will help as well. Other than that I was going to drop my other supplements while on Clomid, but maybe I'll add that back in - sounds like it could be useful for the lining issue.

Thanks!

 

[googly]

Thanks Lancylass - your email has prompted me to question my appointment today!

So just sent a email off to the Department Nurse explaining my disappointment with the appointment and it also gave me the opportunity to restate my concerns with my luteal phase and questioned the possible use of clomid?

We will see if they respond... if not .. will just have to keep the HSG appointment and see if I can rebook to discuss the results of that and hopefully may get a different consultant that I can talk to?

Thanks again for the advice..

You might get a different person, yeah... that would be good. I'd keep it in any case - the more you know, the better off you are eh...

Do you chart etc? I found it quite useful to be able to put all my charts in front of the docs and SHOW them exactly what I was talking about... the FS agreed with me quite quickly after that.

 

[StarSign]

Hey thanks, I will definitely try that out... I'm also doing acupuncture, hoping that will help as well. Other than that I was going to drop my other supplements while on Clomid, but maybe I'll add that back in - sounds like it could be useful for the lining issue.
Thanks!

I'm sure you are, but make sure it's an acupuncturist specializing in fertility (not just female wellness). Also, you may want to decline any herbal offerings because oft times they don't disclose what's in the mix. Dong quai is commonly offered as is black cohosh. I know for fact they can help menopausal gals, but those items can cause probs for those TTC (early bleeding, etc.). But hey, dong quai is in the Fertibella supplement and people report , however an interesting number definitely report early bleeding when they first start on it.

And 400mg of Siberian ginseng in morning or nite on empty tummy is a good starting place.

Happy Needle-pokes!

 

[googly]

Hey thanks, I will definitely try that out... I'm also doing acupuncture, hoping that will help as well. Other than that I was going to drop my other supplements while on Clomid, but maybe I'll add that back in - sounds like it could be useful for the lining issue.
Thanks!

I'm sure you are, but make sure it's an acupuncturist specializing in fertility (not just female wellness). Also, you may want to decline any herbal offerings because oft times they don't disclose what's in the mix. Dong quai is commonly offered as is black cohosh. I know for fact they can help menopausal gals, but those items can cause probs for those TTC (early bleeding, etc.). But hey, dong quai is in the Fertibella supplement and people report , however an interesting number definitely report early bleeding when they first start on it.

And 400mg of Siberian ginseng in morning or nite on empty tummy is a good starting place.

Happy Needle-pokes!

Hi Starsign, yes she is definitely TCM-trained fertility acupuncturist... but not a naturapath actually, so not doing any herbs with her. However - I had been on dong quai due to an earlier recommendation and she had shown my chart to a naturapath friend who said exactly what you just did, i.e. definitely not to take that any more, will NOT be helping my short LP!

I don't think it has mind you, as my LP was consistently way short even before taking dong quai...

In any case, that is gone now! And same for everything else.

But I might try the siberian ginseng... definitely no interaction with the Clomid you reckon?