Sneaking back in...

[BelleNuit]

I think testing for new years eve makes sense Wishn!

So my acupuncturist got back to me, she doesn't want to do the herbs for a 3rd cycle (we've done for the past 2 now) because she wants to see where things are at. She said I could do femara if I want to.

Wishn, I guess the reason why I want to wait is that I feel like if I still have things to try then thats a good thing. I'm just fearful about actually needing IUI or IVF and feel like femara is this thing I have in my back pocket. If I try it and it doesn't work that will really really suck.

 

[MKaykes]

Belle, curious if DH was using weed when he did his SA? I know it's a point of conflict with you two, but I know it can really have an effect...if same usage as when SA was done then probably not a concern. You are just doing so much with the acupuncture and herbs and now thinking femara...I would hate for it all to be fruitless. But, femara has helped my lining, so it could help you too!

 

[WishnandHopn]

Belle I totally get wanting to wait as long as possible before trying the femara and being scared of what it means if it doesn't work. I think that's the feeling I have about moving on to IUI...and at my age (38) we don't have the luxury of time. IVF will be our logical next step if IUI doesn't work and it really scares me.

 

[BelleNuit]

So, DH was using weed daily and multiple times a day (for about a year) up until the end of June 2016. For July/August he claimed he quit but I will confidently bet he was using it at least once a week when out with his friends. His SA was done beginning of September, he had high counts, great motility, morphology was 10% which is above the 4% cut off, but still not an "ideal" number (i.e. above 14%). After he got his SA results he secretly began to smoke again with more frequency (I will bet a couple times a week, but I never get a straight answer out of him because he lies). As far as I am aware he hasn't smoked since our last huge fight ~2 weeks ago, but again, he lies about it. Keep in mind the weed he smokes has a higher THC content then typical. So even if he was smoking a smaller amount it had much more "bang" to it.

So I'm kind of stuck, his SA was pretty good even with occasional use of weed. I keep telling him that it can affect the sperm in a way that the SA doesn't test for (i.e. microfragmentation of dna, hypermotility too early (so they burn out), problems with capacitation (which can affect the ability to enter the egg), etc.

Part of me thinks that if femara can help with my lining, then that might be the one thing holding us back. My AFs have gotten heavier since starting acupuncture, which I think is a good indirect measure of lining. Literally the thinner lining (like slightly on the thin side) and the fact that I have a "slightly tipped cervix" (aka retroflexed uterus), and my very slightly lowered antral follicle count (14 is normal, mine was 13), as well as DH's "slightly lowered morphology" are the only negative things that we have going on. I think its just adding up to inefficiency in our case.... aka subfertility.

Wishn, I can imagine that the worry over needing treatment could be intensified in your case since you might feel like you have less time to work with. On the flip side I have less $$ to work with (but more time to work with), so I feel like its better for us to wait.. especially since we are freaking unexplained. I think its tough to find a good balance between how long to wait, and when to pull out the big guns. Which of course will change for each couple.

DH wants me to wait on femara. He's even more afraid of treatment then I am I think. I don't know what we'll decide, but I want to talk with him about it tonight.

 

[BelleNuit]

Started spotting I think I'm 10 dpo. DH says if I start femara now that I'm admitting that weed doesn't have an effect on sperm. He's such an idiot.

I'm just tired of all of this and want to do whatever I possibly can to make it end. I don't even believe femara will help. It just feels so futile to do nothing.

I think we are going to take a cycle off this next cycle. I need to get my MMR vaccine updated anyway and since its a live vaccine you can't be pregnant when you get it.

I'm like ugly crying I knew I was out this cycle from the beginning anyway, but it still sucks. I wasn't even checking for spotting and wasn't prepared for it.

 

[MKaykes]

Hugs Belle! I am all too familiar with the ugly cry 😭You just never know of it'll be easier as time goes on or harder. This whole process just sucks!

 

[BelleNuit]

Thanks MK, you're so right, you just never know, and it all sucks

 

[WishnandHopn]

Ah Belle...I'm sorry for the spotting and for this whole year of disappointment and frustration you've had. It just sucks. Maybe a month off will do you both good. No need to rush into femara. The sperm cycle takes 2-3 months, and I bet that if DH can stay away from weed for that long he will be able to kick the habit for good.

 

[MKaykes]

I decided it would be so much "fun" to do a hpt just to see a positive for once from the Ovidrel shot. Such a let down, a super faint line, lol! I had to do it now so it was too early to convince myself it could be for real, but what a waste of a test! (Even if it was from the Dollar Store)

 

[Pleasance]

Mk I think it's only natural to want to see that line. I view it as an experiment and so not a waste!

Belle - I don't think that there's a need to rush into fermara either. If you still want to do it naturally and have time, try the other things. Honestly even just the simple thing of switching to drinking nothing but water helped my AF look healthier. It was a small thing to try but helped a lot for me. If you feel like there's little things that you can still try, it's ok to wait.

As for me though, because I'm a little older, my husband and I agreed and I went ahead and started on clomid this month. The RE will only let us try 2 cycles unmonitored though and then wants us to go back in for her true recommendation of IUI.

 

[MKaykes]

Pleasance - Good luck with Clomid, I hope it does the trick for you! I know it is hard to make the jump to treatment. We were the opposite, dr recommended IUI and we could have done 1 or 2 unmedicated since I do O on my own, but we decided to go all in with it. I'm actually really happy we've done the IUI as it takes a lot of stress off knowing through US I have a good follicle, then with the trigger I know we time right, followed by blood work to confirm I had a strong O with enough progesterone to maintain pregnancy...all the guess work and assumptions are gone.

 

[BelleNuit]

MK I really do appreciate your input about treatment and how it has been a positive experience for you so far! It makes me feel like its not such a scary thing after all.

Thanks Pleasance and Wishn for making me feel better about not wanting to start femara right this minute. Everyone else I talk to is just like DO IT lol. They don't get it.

I am feeling pretty solid with my plan to take a cycle off this next cycle to get my MMR immuization updated and then to go ahead with femara in January. My spotting is pretty light, barely there mixed in with cm. If it were to stop today there might still be a chance. BUT this is how it always starts out and AF always follows so I'm not really holding out any hope. Just sending out prayers that maybe this time it will finally be different.

I don't know what I would do without you three to keep me sane sometimes!

 

[WishnandHopn]

MK, I'm sorry your 'second line' experience was a let down...hope the next one you see is the real deal! I do like the idea of being triggered and monitored...it would take the guess work out of figuring out if/when/how good my ovulation was.

Pleasance really hoping that clomid works for you! Will you be monitored or triggered?

Belle I guess that's the thing about spotting before AF...if it is implantation bleeding you would just assume it's your usual spotting! Fx the witch stays away. I think your plan is a good one. Don't let yourself be pressured...you and DH need to both be ready and on the same page about starting treatment, even if it's just a pill.

So we successfully completed sex week! First time we have actually stuck it out doing every other day from day 8 to 16. I had a crazy dream last night that I found out I was pregnant and gave birth to twins the same day! And they could already crawl and I kept losing track of where they'd gone. It was crazy!

 

[Pleasance]

Wishn - the next two cycles will be completely unmonitored and no trigger.

Mk - my husband and I would have definitely made a different decision if finances were no issue. We simply can not afford 3 cycles of monitoring at $1,000 and then still do the IUI cycles at $1,400. Especially given statistical data on success rates and potentially looking down the road to IVF if these cycles don't work. In fact, since we both don't make a ton (my DH is a teacher-some cosmic joke there) we have already decided we most likely won't even do IVF due to finances.

So I know I've been a huge bag of mixed feelings about this, but I have to say I broke down in tears this morning when taking the Clomid. I just kept thinking what a failure I was. It was kind of awful. Then I almost immediately thought I was going to be sick to my stomach within a half hour of taking it. Almost like it was weighing on my conscious as regret. Still not sure how I feel, but as the day is ending, I'm coming a little bit more to terms with it. It's like a big fat reality check of how much this sucks to try to get pregnant this way...feeling like everyone else just gets to do it, taking it for granted. Ugh. Pity party for myself, making me feel so ungrateful for what I do have. Why does everything always feel like such a mixed bag?

 

[BelleNuit]

I read this on another site

women with infertility have a very strong maternal connection to their (not yet conceived) children. Most mothers have to fight on behalf of their children at some point, and there is no wrath like that of a mother whose children have been threatened in some way. Well for infertile women the battle begins before they are even conceived. So in that sense infertile women are like super moms! Anyway I thought that was a cool way of thinking about maternity, especially since I don't have children yet and fear I'll never be a mom. We are all already mothers- fighting for our children. Kind of similar to the "Already in my heart, one day in my arms" quote

https://www.whattoexpect.com/forums...le-women-are-already-mothers-pretty-cool.html

Pleasance what you wrote I can really relate to. But needing fertility treatments just means that we are all super mother's. I really much prefer this way of looking at it. We're here for you to vent any time you need to!

 

[MKaykes]

I like that Belle - super moms long before we hold our babies in our arms! We loose babies we fought for every month we don't conceive (that's how I feel anyway).

I don't know what I would do without the ability to vent of here, others just don't get it. I had dinner with a friend last night and brought up adoption or coming to terms that it maybe won't happen and I got the whole "it'll happen" speech. I really just wanted to scream, no one knows that or can say that, and it isn't helpful! Yes I want to be optimistic, but being hopeful month in and month out gets old! To also find out her and another friend were talking about it, that we just need a vacation and let go...you think we haven't tried that in 2 years?

Getting busy with prepping for Christmas, baked some cookies last night, lots of shopping this afternoon and making some more treats tonight. We are going to my brother in laws in the afternoon tomorrow (had to plan around the MN Vikings football game) so I get to go to my family's in the evening. I have a hard time splitting holidays so it'll be a long day but worth it! 2 more "Christmases" on Christmas day too!

Hope you all have a very happy Christmas!

 

[Pleasance]

Mk. That's exactly why I am not telling my sister. She digs her heels in about how she should think something should work, and won't let it be any other way. And I don't mean she's just stubborn... she's pigheaded, bullish, and insatiably frustrating. I'm normally the one that just goes with whatever she wants because it makes life easier, but this isn't her baby or decision or anything that she has a right to control. It took her 6 months or so to give up on asking if we were still thinking of have kids after I told her I wasn't sure we were going to even try due to not being financially prepared enough. I was trying to gently brooch the subject with her, maybe to have an open conversation since we were already ttc with no luck, but she wouldn't let up about it and how "you'll never have kids if you wait till your financially prepared". I felt like saying - shut the heck up! It'll probably take me several thousand dollars not a cheap bottle of booze at prom!" (Yeah, literally how she got pregnant with her first of three). People that will tell you it will just happen are completely insensitive. And the just relax one is just as bad. I know I went on a bit of a ramble but I'm also tired of people thinking that they can be supportive by telling us the most NOT helpful or judgemental things.

I also did the whole Christmas cookie thing yesterday. My husband even pitched in and made brownies and helped make the pretzel hugs. We have three places to go over two days, so that isn't bad. I still have four more gifts to wrap. And more food to make!

Hope everyone has a Merry Christmas!

 

[WishnandHopn]

I totally get where you're coming from Pleasance. It's like 'why me'? Why is it easy for her and so hard for me? None of this is fair and I've spent a fair bit of time this year wallowing in self-pity. And then I do feel guilty for not appreciating the things I do have, and all the ways that I'm really lucky.

I really like the "super mom" idea, and I think that those of us who've struggled will appreciate our pregnancies and children if not more then maybe in a different way than those who it came easy to. I am normally a sharer, and in the beginning I did tell some friends and family that we have been ttc, but as time goes on, I just talk about it less and less with anyone in real life and luckily most people in our lives are not nosy and asking questions, realizing that we won't be discussing it until we have good news and are ready to share. I think some people honestly mean well and have no clue that the things they say are hurtful, but some are just insensitive jerks and all we can do it avoid those people and/or avoid those conversations. I'm so grateful for having you all to vent to! I would definitely feel much more alone in this without this forum.

Wishing you all a very Merry Christmas!

 

[BelleNuit]

Pleasance, your sister sounds a lot like my aunt. Not long ago she was berating me that we shouldn't wait long to have kids (we had already been trying for a year by then which she didn't know). Some people just don't get it and deserve a good smack.

I hope everyone has a lovely Christmas holiday!

AFM, the spotting hasnt picked up at all, it's still just slightly tan cm. I should be 12 dpo by now and I always start spotting in the afternoon by 12 dpo (enough so that it shows up on TP). So far nothing more than slightly darker cm. I think I will test tomorrow morning so I know if I can drink or not. I don't want to get my hopes up as I've been disappointed so many times before and my AF always starts with tan cm. But I am praying for a Christmas miracle.

 

[MKaykes]

Praying for your Belle!