Syria

[bumpy_j]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...to-house-desperate-syrian-refugees/ar-AAe8Uo6

After seeing so many people speaking 'on behalf' of our veterans, this was amazing to see.

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

Wow. ^

 

[BabyMamma93]

im sorry but my opinion still stands as it is. im not judging the whole of a race because of a minority of people, and im not saying we shouldnt help them, i just dont think letting them into Britain will be it, as said they will come and work, jobs that the British struggle to get, i once asked my Asian boss if he would give my OH a job as a decorator, handy man etc. he said no because hes not qualified, although its proven he can do the jobs (not electrical or gas) a week later he hired a foreign guy who had just come to the country, also with no qualifications in that feild of work, he didnt pay him less, it didnt work out any better for him, infact worse because the guy cant even paint. so there (maybe a really crap example) my OH was denied a job that a foreign guy who has no residency to live here then got.
In my prev. job, one friday i was told not to bother coming into work on monday because they cant afford to pay me, i walked past the office that monday they had put 3 foreign people in the office, so i was without a job, so that they could work there.. fair? i think not
no im not saying refugees should stay where they are because of these 2 crap examples, im just saying there isnt enough jobs and homes as it is, not enough jobs or homes to house the people who live in britain, so why bring more people in?? you cant book a room in a hotel if its full can you.

yes im probably quite uneducated but that doesnt mean i cant have my opinions.
NO I AM NOT RACIST and i also dont think im the worst person in the world like you all think i am.

as for my 'country will just be rubble' comment, how do we know they arent going to destroy our country, as ive said before, how do we know what their intentions are. and yes we dont know what intentions are of babies born here, but alot (not all) intentions of foreign people are not to make our country a beautiful and multi cultural place to live, its so they have a easier life while making some of British citizens life harder!
i also dont think its fair to say 'we have tvs, laptops, phones etc they dont' thats not my fault.. the homeless guy who pees and sh*ts himself also doesnt have a toilet, sanitation, a phone, food, tv, not even a poxy jigsaw or a blanket to keep him warm, but we are too busy helping other countries we are instead turning our nose up at the guy who probably worked his arse off, paid taxes and unfortunatley now going through a bad time, im sorry but thats where my sympathy lies. and yes i do something to help if i can, i either give spare change, or last week i bought some dog food for one of them because they had a dog, i also gave him some water and a cheap sarny for himself, i refuse to give to charities in all honesty i may put change in a charity box if its there, i buy poppies, daffodils, and wrist bands and give a poor homeless guy what i can. but i will not sign up to anything no matter what its for.

Ok, I have a few questions:

1. First bit in bold - how do you know this? You say it with so much certainty, what makes you sure of their intentions?

2. I find it interesting that you are prepared to give the benefit of the doubt to the homeless man as to how he found himself in that situation "probably worked his arse off, paid taxes and unfortunatley now going through a bad time", but you question the intentions (not even the actions) of people fleeing for their lives. Arguably, he has not contributed to society, is certainly not doing so now, and is probably a drain on the system too (these are not my views on the homeless, BTW). You don't know how he got there, but we should help him, but not, say, vulnerable children, because, what - he's British? He was here first? He's white? Why does human empathy have to stop at the borders? At this risk of being accused of living in "rainbow and unicorn" land again, why can't we strive to help all those in need?

your right i dont KNOW this for a fact, but it does happen right? i had a teacher at school, who came to our country became a teacher and lived happily ever after, until he set off a bomb in London, he was a suicide bomber, and that was his intention all along.
Theres a takeaway near me, it was owned by people from a different country that came over here to run a business, however many years later, they blew them self up in london too, again, thats was their intention all along,
the guy i work for, his father is currently wanted in this country, why?? because he came over here to rob our government, he had a deal to sell some gas or oil or something, took the money from the government and left them with empty containers. millions of pounds he stole from our country, and guess what? THAT WAS HIS INTENTION!!

as for the homeless man, i never said he was white? or British.. in all honesty i have no idea on his nationality, he was filthy from living rough and didnt speak..

I dont understand why we cant help them in other ways, help them take back their country, why dont we help their children and their elderly and the men do something, like oh i dont know, fight for their country like our men do just for it to be taken over anyway. we could help them fight, why not? wouldnt that make more sense than just placing them in different countries here there and everywhere for how long? okay so they cant claim benefits or work. so how will they live?? yes it will be a little safer for them (if the ISIS arent sneaking in too- which they more likely will) but how will they live, how will they feed, clothe and water them self??

 

[Kate&Lucas]

Oh come the fuck on. Is this really what the debate has come to?
I'm done.

 

[Pearls18]

Head. Brick. Wall.

 

[bumpy_j]

If you're talking about the 7/7 bombers, 3/4 of them were British born with Pakistani parentage, and one was oringinally from Jamaica but moved here as a child. Attaching the plight of the Syrians to the actions of British born and bred radicalised Muslims with heritage from an entirely different nation isn't particularly fair.

An extremist fringe within Syria (and many foreign fighters who seem to have no respect of the culture or history of Syria) have exploited a civil war whilst the country was in a fragile state; the motives of the uprising four years ago were originally secular, with aim to end Assads autocratic regime. Remember, the West is very keen on seeing Assad go into exile, so the motivation for us to get involved is already there. And somewhere along the line, these extremist rebels were trained and armed.

So you have your civilians. Many (although not all) disillusioned and angered by living under what they deem to be an undemocratic and brutal regime. And now you have a band of (unfortunately well armed) hooligans, many whom aren't Syrian themselves, who also want to take out Assad, but so to put in place an almost genocidal regime dictated by an incredibly distorted view of a religious ideology. I mean why not go for the jugular of a country already under chaos? So you're telling the average Syrian to stay put, and fight with sticks and stones...against whom exactly? There is not a 'big baddy' in this, there is an absolute clusterfuck of a power struggle.

 

[Tasha]

im sorry but my opinion still stands as it is. im not judging the whole of a race because of a minority of people, and im not saying we shouldnt help them, i just dont think letting them into Britain will be it, as said they will come and work, jobs that the British struggle to get, i once asked my Asian boss if he would give my OH a job as a decorator, handy man etc. he said no because hes not qualified, although its proven he can do the jobs (not electrical or gas) a week later he hired a foreign guy who had just come to the country, also with no qualifications in that feild of work, he didnt pay him less, it didnt work out any better for him, infact worse because the guy cant even paint. so there (maybe a really crap example) my OH was denied a job that a foreign guy who has no residency to live here then got.
In my prev. job, one friday i was told not to bother coming into work on monday because they cant afford to pay me, i walked past the office that monday they had put 3 foreign people in the office, so i was without a job, so that they could work there.. fair? i think not
no im not saying refugees should stay where they are because of these 2 crap examples, im just saying there isnt enough jobs and homes as it is, not enough jobs or homes to house the people who live in britain, so why bring more people in?? you cant book a room in a hotel if its full can you.

yes im probably quite uneducated but that doesnt mean i cant have my opinions.
NO I AM NOT RACIST and i also dont think im the worst person in the world like you all think i am.

as for my 'country will just be rubble' comment, how do we know they arent going to destroy our country, as ive said before, how do we know what their intentions are. and yes we dont know what intentions are of babies born here, but alot (not all) intentions of foreign people are not to make our country a beautiful and multi cultural place to live, its so they have a easier life while making some of British citizens life harder!
i also dont think its fair to say 'we have tvs, laptops, phones etc they dont' thats not my fault.. the homeless guy who pees and sh*ts himself also doesnt have a toilet, sanitation, a phone, food, tv, not even a poxy jigsaw or a blanket to keep him warm, but we are too busy helping other countries we are instead turning our nose up at the guy who probably worked his arse off, paid taxes and unfortunatley now going through a bad time, im sorry but thats where my sympathy lies. and yes i do something to help if i can, i either give spare change, or last week i bought some dog food for one of them because they had a dog, i also gave him some water and a cheap sarny for himself, i refuse to give to charities in all honesty i may put change in a charity box if its there, i buy poppies, daffodils, and wrist bands and give a poor homeless guy what i can. but i will not sign up to anything no matter what its for.

Ok, I have a few questions:

1. First bit in bold - how do you know this? You say it with so much certainty, what makes you sure of their intentions?

2. I find it interesting that you are prepared to give the benefit of the doubt to the homeless man as to how he found himself in that situation "probably worked his arse off, paid taxes and unfortunatley now going through a bad time", but you question the intentions (not even the actions) of people fleeing for their lives. Arguably, he has not contributed to society, is certainly not doing so now, and is probably a drain on the system too (these are not my views on the homeless, BTW). You don't know how he got there, but we should help him, but not, say, vulnerable children, because, what - he's British? He was here first? He's white? Why does human empathy have to stop at the borders? At this risk of being accused of living in "rainbow and unicorn" land again, why can't we strive to help all those in need?

your right i dont KNOW this for a fact, but it does happen right? i had a teacher at school, who came to our country became a teacher and lived happily ever after, until he set off a bomb in London, he was a suicide bomber, and that was his intention all along.
Theres a takeaway near me, it was owned by people from a different country that came over here to run a business, however many years later, they blew them self up in london too, again, thats was their intention all along,
the guy i work for, his father is currently wanted in this country, why?? because he came over here to rob our government, he had a deal to sell some gas or oil or something, took the money from the government and left them with empty containers. millions of pounds he stole from our country, and guess what? THAT WAS HIS INTENTION!!

as for the homeless man, i never said he was white? or British.. in all honesty i have no idea on his nationality, he was filthy from living rough and didnt speak..

I dont understand why we cant help them in other ways, help them take back their country, why dont we help their children and their elderly and the men do something, like oh i dont know, fight for their country like our men do just for it to be taken over anyway. we could help them fight, why not? wouldnt that make more sense than just placing them in different countries here there and everywhere for how long? okay so they cant claim benefits or work. so how will they live?? yes it will be a little safer for them (if the ISIS arent sneaking in too- which they more likely will) but how will they live, how will they feed, clothe and water them self??

What suicide bombers were these? The only ones in aware of are the 7/7 ones? None of them were teachers though, one was a learning mentor at a primary school for immigrant children and he was born in Leeds. Three of the four of them were home grown terrorists. None of them worked or owned a take away either. I don't think it's fair to share things that aren't factual.

ETA his father owned the take away and he was born in the uk

 

[babyjan]

I agree with above! What does the 7/7 bombers have to do with the Syrian refugees?

 

[LoraLoo]

I agree with above! What does the 7/7 bombers have to do with the Syrian refugees?

Some people can't separate religion from terrorists 😐

 

[Tasha]

I agree, they've nothing to do with refugees but if the point was that foreign people might do bad things, it's certainly not a case of point proven since three quarters of the July bombers were UK born.

 

[CRWx]

Are we forgetting that white, English people do bad things in our country too? probably more so than anybody that moves here.

Foreign people aren't the enemy, bad people are, believe it or not, being an a awful person manifests as any race, sex, etc.

 

[lisa1980]

The terrifying thing is that this view seems to be quite widely held. Apparently history teaches some of us nothing whatsoever.

There seems to be no point arguing with facts, as facts don't seem to have any impact on the general xenophobia (and, frankly, racism - no one mentions Anders breivik in the discussions about terrorism even though he killed a shed load of people for 'religious' reasons. Apparently you can't be white and a terrorist - you're just a lone mad man that no other white person has to apologise for ). Do we blame all Irish people for what the IRA did? It's a dangerous game...as a British person I'd probably have more to be blamed for throughout history than most.

I think when the facts are so wildly misunderstood (often purposfully to suit a particular agenda I think), it's totally futile to try to reason or inspire compassion or understanding.

Bumpy, your post had me in tears. I will never, ever understand anyone who can continue to spout hate after reading that. It's beyond me.

 

[maryp0ppins]

This thread has gone way off topic, as someone who is an immigrant to Britain all I can say is that the process is expensive and NOTHING is simply handed to you. I have nothing else to add.

 

[broodymrs]

This seems to have gone off topic! Not reading all the comments but if anyone wants to help the refugees there's lots of groups doing good work. The one I've sent stuff to is called kos kindness. You can find them on Facebook. You can easily send them supplies they then distribute to the refugees.

Helping the refugees isn't exclusive. You can still give homeless people money and food, and donate to charity! That's in response to the comment on the previous page. There doesn't have to be a limit on compassion

 

[Larkspur]

yes it will be a little safer for them (if the ISIS arent sneaking in too- which they more likely will) but how will they live, how will they feed, clothe and water them self??

Okay, no.

A) It will be a LOT safer for them. Like the difference between worrying about whether a bomb will fall on their homes, and being able to sleep in peace. Or even having a home to go to that hasn't been destroyed by a bomb. Or their children being able to get an education again, because their school hasn't been overrun by militants using it as a base. Or hundreds of other examples of the awful suffering and the destruction of any kind of normal life that the Syrian refugees are facing.

B) As I said before, ISIS is not all that interested in sneaking into Britain. They want to establish an Islamic State in the Middle East. The whole point of it is that it's an area with a continuous border. They're trying to set up their own "religious country" if you like. So they would only be interested in trying to come to Britain and take over if they had already expanded the Islamic State to cover mainland Europe right up to the French coastline. In which case your problems would be a lot bigger than Syrian refugees.

C) The new arrivals will look after themselves the way they did in their own country, by getting jobs, earning money, etc. They are normal people with skills and educations and a desperate willingness to make new lives for themselves somewhere that sudden death isn't a daily hazard.

More people EQUALS more jobs. Someone has to grow the food for the extra people and build the houses, and teach the kids and so on! Immigration benefits countries in the long run, you just have to take a marginally longer view of it.

Sure, there will be some short-term pressure, but considering that European governments in part created this situation by financing the Syrian militants and/or turning a blind eye to the atrocities for so long (in case you don't realise this, most Syrian refugees are fleeing from the atrocities inflicted by their own government, rather than from ISIS), it seems like that's the price you now pay to not have dead toddlers washing up on beaches any more.

 

[BabyMamma93]

so you say they will support them selves by getting jobs, but someone has already said they cant get a job while they are refugees, so really they have all intention of just living here and the other countries forever? i just dont see why we cant help them fight for their country instead of taking them in here when we can hardly afford the amount of people already living here.
what about in 10 years time when there is no NHS left, and you, your family or god forbid one of YOUR children need it, what then? well its tough we will have to pay for the health care with very little money as people in this country dont want to give people a job from this country because people from other countries are happy to work for alot les which of corse, every employer is happy with!! my opinion has still not changed, i never said i hate anyone, i just think we all need to be a little bit more selfish and think of what it could possibly do to our country!

im also out nothing more i can really say without people hating me for it so..

 

[suzib76]

so you say they will support them selves by getting jobs, but someone has already said they cant get a job while they are refugees, so really they have all intention of just living here and the other countries forever? i just dont see why we cant help them fight for their country instead of taking them in here when we can hardly afford the amount of people already living here.
what about in 10 years time when there is no NHS left, and you, your family or god forbid one of YOUR children need it, what then? well its tough we will have to pay for the health care with very little money as people in this country dont want to give people a job from this country because people from other countries are happy to work for alot les which of corse, every employer is happy with!! my opinion has still not changed, i never said i hate anyone, i just think we all need to be a little bit more selfish and think of what it could possibly do to our country!

im also out nothing more i can really say without people hating me for it so..

Have you actually looked around the country you are living in?

You seem awful concerned that people are going to come here and take 'our' jobs. Well they are not our jobs they are simply 'jobs' and as a pp has already said, more people will actually help to create more jobs. That's without mentioning the level of unemployment through choice that we already have. We have people who leech off society and choose never to do a days work.m people who stuff their veins with heroin, people who have 4/5/6/7/8 whatever amount of children and get handed every single penny from the government.

But yeah, you rock on with your concern about how refugees will affect us. But I tell you what, the biggest single thing to affect the good hardworking people of the United Kingdom is other people already in the UK

 

[Miss Vintage]

Agree with the above. Also, you seem to be very ignorant of the cause of this crises. I suggest you do a lot more reading on the war in Syria before suggesting that even more angry young men take up arms. Another militia, yeah, that's exactly what Syria needs.

 

[Pearls18]

so you say they will support them selves by getting jobs, but someone has already said they cant get a job while they are refugees, so really they have all intention of just living here and the other countries forever? i just dont see why we cant help them fight for their country instead of taking them in here when we can hardly afford the amount of people already living here.
what about in 10 years time when there is no NHS left, and you, your family or god forbid one of YOUR children need it, what then? well its tough we will have to pay for the health care with very little money as people in this country dont want to give people a job from this country because people from other countries are happy to work for alot les which of corse, every employer is happy with!! my opinion has still not changed, i never said i hate anyone, i just think we all need to be a little bit more selfish and think of what it could possibly do to our country!

im also out nothing more i can really say without people hating me for it so..

If you are genuinely worried about this to the point you have formulated these opinions I really suggest you do some reading up on the whole thing, I don't mean reading these threads or Facebook memes I mean actual reading, it is impossible to discuss something with someone who is being so deliberately obtuse, you are making no effort to learn any actual facts, you glide over the posts that have the most informed opinions and stating we are "hating you", no one hates you, you're entitled to an opinion but an opinion isn't worth anything if you haven't even attempted to inform yourself enough about the topic, it probably feels personal because it's your ignorance on the matter that is being debated because you haven't stated anything factual to properly discuss. I put my hands up and say I really don't know much, but I know enough to never say it's black and white, I can only empathise with the whole humanitarian crisis. It's frustrating when you can't acknowledge anything anyone is telling you, it's like you don't want to be told anything useful because it's easier to just begrudge the situation, and you're not alone in that- it's why certain media outlets thrive, many people are like it, but it doesn't make it right.

 

[BabyMamma93]

ive never said anything about it being black or white, i never said all of one race do something and i never said we shouldnt ever let anyone in this country of a different rqace to us, people on here saying they are immigrants and whining because of my opinions i never said anything about no one been allowed here, i just said i dont think we should let hundreds, thousand whatever, refugees in, never said anything about black and white, i also did say im uneducated on this, i dont follow the news, and i havent said any facts because i dont know any facts im jst saying my opinions thats all