Unschooling?

[Tacey]

thanks for the link, i still dont understand the legal side, i mean how do you get away with sending a child to school?

I understand the idea, i think its really internesting and i understand how it can work well, i think a child who is "unschooled" can grow up with the same educational level as any other child, after all there are different things each child excells at, and secondary schools provide options with subject choice so children from diffrent areas of the counrty will all be differently educated anyway.

I am sure that teh majority of children will want to educate themselves with basic skills such as reading, so i totally understand and apprecaite how it works.

However the idea of not educating you child at all is more strange to me, i mean, we "teach" our children to speak, to toilet train etc, i again understand that they will learn these skills in their own time but cant imagine standing completly back and letting them take charge of their future.

I agree that children learn better when they are interested, when my mum tried to teach me to read she choose several nice books and i just wasnt interested, she let me free to explore and i choose books about sharks, dinosaurs and nature, then i wanted to know more and read them to myself.

i totally think homeschooling can produce very educated children, i would love to do it myself, but i dont have the pateience or the abilities to do it. I am dyslexic and my husband also shows some tendancies, we are both very educated, great school grades, i went on to uni and flew through that, but my ability to correct spelling would be terrible, my math skills are basic, i couldnt teach my son those skills.

However the unschooling thing is still very different from that, how do you stop yoursef from teaching? How can it be safe to not have rules? i mean my kid loves to climb do you let your child climb, run into roads etc? how do you teach respect? I totally think letting the child get more independance as he/she gets older is a good thing and letting them outline their education is great, but i dont understand how it works in practice

Do you mean not sending a child to school? If so the law is very clear, at 5 years old a child must, legally, be educated. Most parents choose to send a child to school in order to meet this requirement, however it is the parent's choice what form the education can take.

The vast majority of home educators (both those that unschool and those that don't) will tell you that they don't 'teach' their children - instead they enable and facilitate the learning that a child wants to explore. Some things, such as road safety etc must be taught and some boundaries must be enforced. Unschooling and child-led education does not mean having no rules and no discipline, it means allowing children to learn in their own time.

sorry for all the questions, im only answer out of interest.

does there not need to be proof (for want of a better word) of learning? I mean i understand how that works in a normal home school enviroment but unschooling, at least from what i understood from the documentary, means no rules, no eductaion, no structure i.e. no bedtimes, let the children decide when and what they want to eat etc.

The local authority need to see information that shows your child is being educated according to their age and ability. You can decide how to go about giving that information. There are usually visits too. I think there are big variations in what people see as 'education' and that's where confusion arises.

 

[gemabee]

Some people have said they believe children who do well having been unschooled are the exception. I wonder if you could explain what your basis for saying that is?

I plan to unschool my children. I prefer the term 'autonomous education' (which is the same thing) as it emphasises that the children are being educated. It's just that they do it themselves. Our children generally learn to talk without formal teaching, they have an innate desire to mimic and learn. I don't see why that urge should stop.We all know how curious small children are. Autonomously educated children often maintain that curiosity and learn as a result. Personally, I would be far more concerned for my children's learning if I sent them to school, but different things suit different families.

common sense.

You're actually coming across as a bit offensive to both those that choose to unschool and those that were unschooled. Unless you can actually back up your argument with actual facts then you really shouldn't use that argument

i was asked to explain my reasonings... i did... i based it on me usin my common sense... i said this because if someone is unschooled their entire life nd get to 16+ with no formal qualifications its not only gonna be harder for them to gain the basic qualifications needed to access higher education... thats common sense!
no-one should get offended at my views towards unschoolin... why should complete strangers care... if that was the case i could get offended at the way some people choose to 'educate' their children... but i dont.

 

[Ozzieshunni]

Gemabee, I think the point that is being made is that if you make an argument, you should try and back it up with facts. I didn't make assumptions and asked if anyone else unschooled because I was curious to see how common it was. The program depicted a family in the US so I was wondering if it was common in the UK. By putting "educate" in quotes, you are insulting how some people educate their children and going against your own statement that you don't get offended by it.

 

[m_t_rose]

Some people have said they believe children who do well having been unschooled are the exception. I wonder if you could explain what your basis for saying that is?

I plan to unschool my children. I prefer the term 'autonomous education' (which is the same thing) as it emphasises that the children are being educated. It's just that they do it themselves. Our children generally learn to talk without formal teaching, they have an innate desire to mimic and learn. I don't see why that urge should stop.We all know how curious small children are. Autonomously educated children often maintain that curiosity and learn as a result. Personally, I would be far more concerned for my children's learning if I sent them to school, but different things suit different families.

common sense.

You're actually coming across as a bit offensive to both those that choose to unschool and those that were unschooled. Unless you can actually back up your argument with actual facts then you really shouldn't use that argument

i was asked to explain my reasonings... i did... i based it on me usin my common sense... i said this because if someone is unschooled their entire life nd get to 16+ with no formal qualifications its not only gonna be harder for them to gain the basic qualifications needed to access higher education... thats common sense!
no-one should get offended at my views towards unschoolin... why should complete strangers care... if that was the case i could get offended at the way some people choose to 'educate' their children... but i dont.

At least in Canada and the US a lot of schools "court" home-schooled students because they are usually ahead of their peers and have a desire to learn and extrapolate better than the student that were "spoon fed" their education by their teachers. Since the child gets to pick which subjects they enjoy the most they will really immerse themselves into that subject. So I would say home-school and also unschooled pupils are usually quite successful.

We also cannot forget that education level does not automatically make a person successful. Their are many unemployed people that have masters degrees and many very successful people who have hardly any education at all.

 

[Ozzieshunni]

I agree!!!! I've met some people with higher level degrees that are dumb as a brush! I wonder how they got through school and college in the first place sometimes!

 

[indy and lara]

A good preschool should be using a child led approach to learning which has similarities to unschooling. For me, I would not be happy making a decision to follow unschooling with Emma. I am a teacher so naturally I am pro formal education!!

I have seen recently a move in some preschools to formal teaching of phonics which I disagree with. Should that be happening locally then Emma won't go to nursery and we will find a suitable playschool for her instead. Nursery should be 100% child led but this is not always the case I do not agree either with this focus on marks and grading that has crept in to schools. I hate when children only believe their work is worthwhile if they get a good grade for it. Assessment for Learning is starting to address this but there is a long way to go.

What is the difference between unschooling and the Steiner system?

 

[Ozzieshunni]

A good preschool should be using a child led approach to learning which has similarities to unschooling. For me, I would not be happy making a decision to follow unschooling with Emma. I am a teacher so naturally I am pro formal education!!

I have seen recently a move in some preschools to formal teaching of phonics which I disagree with. Should that be happening locally then Emma won't go to nursery and we will find a suitable playschool for her instead. Nursery should be 100% child led but this is not always the case I do not agree either with this focus on marks and grading that has crept in to schools. I hate when children only believe their work is worthwhile if they get a good grade for it. Assessment for Learning is starting to address this but there is a long way to go.

What is the difference between unschooling and the Steiner system?

There's a name I haven't heard since my early childhood education studies! It is pretty much the same concept IMO. I worked in a preschool in California that used creative curriculum. If the children showed an interest in something, we would plan the activities around that and the kids loved it! My favorite topic to teach was rainbows around the rainy season. There's so much you can do with it! I would hate to see my children just learning ABCs and numbers in preschool or doing worksheets! It's up to parents however to take an active role in their child's education as well and not just depend on the schools.

 

[freckleonear]

Steiner education is based on the theory of anthroposophy. It is very "earth" based so gardening and nature play a large part. It tends to focus on art, drama, movement, music and crafts. Students have one teacher throughout their school years, reading is often not taught until the age of 7 and TV is strongly discouraged.

 

[indy and lara]

^^^Thank you. They seemed similar but I presumed there would be differences. I agree strongly that parents should play a very active part in their child's education- as a parent you are the primary source for children to learn from. However, I think it is completely inappropriate for preschool children to be undertaking formal learning.

 

[stella123]

I personally doubt I'll ever be financially stable enough to home school, and need the routine that unschooling (feeding and bed times) lacks.

However, I fully support anyone who successfully does either, and I agree that the state of learning in this country is appalling. Personally, I'd like my children to go to a Montessori pre-school to learn about respect and other values and cultures, whilst interacting with adults and their peers on an equal level.

Interesting hearing everyone's own opinion

 

[Ozzieshunni]

Montessori schools are good for self-teaching. A teacher will demonstrate an activity once and then let the children try it. It does teach independence in learning.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montessori_method <if anyone is interested in Montessori theory

 

[birdiex]

i saw this nd god did it make me angry!
what made me laugh is they were playin with a dr's or vet's kit nd all i could think was - 'how ironic... ur playin with that yet denyin ur kids the opportunity to do that as a career because they'll have no formal qualifications'.
bein a parent isn't jus about lettin ur children have a good childhood... its disciplinin them, preparin them for the future, nd allowin them every opportunity u can feasibly give them!
gah... makes me mad.

I think home schoolin is ok done correctly. Unschoolin (nd a lot of other styles of parentin shown in the program) I will never agree with, nd frankly I find ridiculous. My son will get a formal education, with formal qualifications, nd I'll discipline him... AND I'll give him a happy childhood - it is possible! Imo anyone who's done ok with unschoolin is the exception - not the rule.

I haven't read the whole topic but I'm finding what you're saying quite offensive. To the bolded comments - as many other people on here have said, you can still get to uni from being unschooled, and did you realise that your child can choose exams if they want to? An unschooled child could end up with plenty of GCSEs if that's what they chose to do, they can go to college and certainly can go to university. You are denying them of NOTHING by unschooling them. Did you ever consider that you might be taking away the opportunity for them to love learning by sending them to structured education? I hated school, I hate college and I CANNOT WAIT to do an open university course because guess what? I learn best by muddling through, gathering information and making sense of something myself, instead of sitting in a classroom being spoonfed by some teacher.
And who ever said that unschooling meant they'd have no discipline and an unhappy childhood?

I am planning to unschool Albert. I believe I will be able to provide a better learning environment for him than he will receive at school. He is starting nursery next week, at a child first nursery, which I am hoping will set him up to learn from an early age until I am able to help him learn at home.

Why is it that people assume that just because you don't follow the government approved curriculum your child will not be successful in life? I did very well at school but my life skills were absolutely shocking until I had my son. I don't want that for him, I want him to learn using practical methods instead of sitting in a classroom, only interacting with children the same age as him and believing that all adults are superior

It's all personal opinion, there is no need to slate home schoolers, just as none of the people educating at home would slate anyone deciding to put their child through the school system.

"The only thing that interferes with my learning is my education." - Albert Einstein

I TOTALLY agree with you here hun! And to the bolded - probably the same reason most people believe that hospitals MUST be safest for births - lack of education. Anything different is scary, and we're constantly told that if we don't do well at school, have good attendance and behave well, we'll never succeed at anything. We all have that fear of being a bum or a benefit scrounger (no offence meant to people on benefits of course, I mean the people who play the system and can't be bothered to work), and I know I've always just assumed that I had to do well at school to do well at life.
I want to be able to provide my kids with confidence in their own skills for learning, let them decide what they want to learn, and give them the tools to work it out for themselves - if they're anything like me, they'll love it and it'll do them so much good! I'll also give them the option to take GCSEs if they want to. Some courses though at colleges do have provisions for people with no qualifications. For example, childcare at my local college says that you need 5 a*-c GCSEs, or relevant experience ect. Surely if your unschooling all of your children, they'll have lots of experience in helping look after their younger siblings?

 

[indy and lara]

Can I ask what you would do if unschooling doesn't work for your child? There is not a 'one size fits all' in education or in how someone learns so if this doesn't suit your child, would you consider a more formal school environment? My personal learning preference is more formal and rigid so for example, unschooling would have been a bit of a disaster for me!

 

[birdiex]

Can I ask what you would do if unschooling doesn't work for your child? There is not a 'one size fits all' in education or in how someone learns so if this doesn't suit your child, would you consider a more formal school environment? My personal learning preference is more formal and rigid so for example, unschooling would have been a bit of a disaster for me!

If it was me, I'd carry on unschooling. When you unschool, your child shows an interest in something and you facilitate that learning. If they need a certain approach (for example, kinetic learners need more active ways to learn than audio learners), then that's what you provide. If my child was one that needed a set activity or a set task i would give them that based on what THEY wanted to learn, and provide all the guidance and support neccessary. Does that make sense? I know what I'm trying to say but I'm not sure if it came out very clear!

ETA: I mean a set task as in "go and find this out on the computer/in a book for me, have a think about it and come back and tell me about what you've learned", and then we could have a discussion about it or do an activity based on that. Does that make better sense?

 

[indy and lara]

Just curious, thanks. I am teacher so I don't think along the lines of unschooling for Emma but wondered what people do if it goes wrong/ isn't for the child.

 

[Tacey]

Just curious, thanks. I am teacher so I don't think along the lines of unschooling for Emma but wondered what people do if it goes wrong/ isn't for the child.

After the age of about 7, I'd let Alice go to school if she really wanted to, and understood what it involved. I'd offer lots of alternatives before that though! What do you mean by went wrong?

I'm a teacher too, but have kind of sabotaged my career since looking into autonomous education as I've really lost faith in the whole system now!

 

[Ju_bubbs]

Very interesting subject! I didn't see the program and dont know much about unschooling, apart from the few bits I've read on this thread so can't really have a huge opinion!

I do think that maybe I may have gone down either a unschooling or atleast homeschooling route tho, if I'd have been open minded enough to look into things like this 12 years ago when I had my eldest! I REALLY hate school, I think they're awful places to send children, no matter how 'good' a school looks on paper, there will always be other kids there who bully, swear and generally teach your kids things you really dont want them knowing/doing.

I always wanted to be homeschooled - I LOVED learning, but school.. I hated. I didn't want or need to know about the spanish armada and sedemantary rocks etc! By the time I was in year 6 of primary school, I had worked my way up to year 9 secondary school maths text books, then when I went to secondary school the teachers wondered why I didn't want to sit and do all this crap over again! So I didn't, I did no coursework, sat and chatted in lessons simply because nothing at school tested my mind or interested me! (I did love the look on the teachers faces when they found I passed 10 GCSE's at A to C after giving birth the day before the exams started tho ) They even made me sit an official IQ test to 'get to the bottom of my behaviour problems' and when they found that it was 169, which got me into MENSA, still didn't do anything about it and made me sit through the same lessons!! I then didn't go to college or university because I honestly could not bear it after all the years of school! I'm sure had I been educated at home, things would have been very different!

 

[birdiex]

Very interesting subject! I didn't see the program and dont know much about unschooling, apart from the few bits I've read on this thread so can't really have a huge opinion!

I do think that maybe I may have gone down either a unschooling or atleast homeschooling route tho, if I'd have been open minded enough to look into things like this 12 years ago when I had my eldest! I REALLY hate school, I think they're awful places to send children, no matter how 'good' a school looks on paper, there will always be other kids there who bully, swear and generally teach your kids things you really dont want them knowing/doing.

I always wanted to be homeschooled - I LOVED learning, but school.. I hated. I didn't want or need to know about the spanish armada and sedemantary rocks etc! By the time I was in year 6 of primary school, I had worked my way up to year 9 secondary school maths text books, then when I went to secondary school the teachers wondered why I didn't want to sit and do all this crap over again! So I didn't, I did no coursework, sat and chatted in lessons simply because nothing at school tested my mind or interested me! (I did love the look on the teachers faces when they found I passed 10 GCSE's at A to C after giving birth the day before the exams started tho ) They even made me sit an official IQ test to 'get to the bottom of my behaviour problems' and when they found that it was 169, which got me into MENSA, still didn't do anything about it and made me sit through the same lessons!! I then didn't go to college or university because I honestly could not bear it after all the years of school! I'm sure had I been educated at home, things would have been very different!

You sound JUST like me, even down to the GCSEs. I passed 10, A*-C, no coursework, no revision, nothing. My IQ is slightly lesser at 143 though. To the bolded, I couldn't say it better myself. Do we have a nodding emoticon?

 

[Ju_bubbs]

Very interesting subject! I didn't see the program and dont know much about unschooling, apart from the few bits I've read on this thread so can't really have a huge opinion!

I do think that maybe I may have gone down either a unschooling or atleast homeschooling route tho, if I'd have been open minded enough to look into things like this 12 years ago when I had my eldest! I REALLY hate school, I think they're awful places to send children, no matter how 'good' a school looks on paper, there will always be other kids there who bully, swear and generally teach your kids things you really dont want them knowing/doing.

I always wanted to be homeschooled - I LOVED learning, but school.. I hated. I didn't want or need to know about the spanish armada and sedemantary rocks etc! By the time I was in year 6 of primary school, I had worked my way up to year 9 secondary school maths text books, then when I went to secondary school the teachers wondered why I didn't want to sit and do all this crap over again! So I didn't, I did no coursework, sat and chatted in lessons simply because nothing at school tested my mind or interested me! (I did love the look on the teachers faces when they found I passed 10 GCSE's at A to C after giving birth the day before the exams started tho ) They even made me sit an official IQ test to 'get to the bottom of my behaviour problems' and when they found that it was 169, which got me into MENSA, still didn't do anything about it and made me sit through the same lessons!! I then didn't go to college or university because I honestly could not bear it after all the years of school! I'm sure had I been educated at home, things would have been very different!

You sound JUST like me, even down to the GCSEs. I passed 10, A*-C, no coursework, no revision, nothing. My IQ is slightly lesser at 143 though. To the bolded, I couldn't say it better myself. Do we have a nodding emoticon?

 

[bubbles]

Very interesting subject! I didn't see the program and dont know much about unschooling, apart from the few bits I've read on this thread so can't really have a huge opinion!

I do think that maybe I may have gone down either a unschooling or atleast homeschooling route tho, if I'd have been open minded enough to look into things like this 12 years ago when I had my eldest! I REALLY hate school, I think they're awful places to send children, no matter how 'good' a school looks on paper, there will always be other kids there who bully, swear and generally teach your kids things you really dont want them knowing/doing.

I always wanted to be homeschooled - I LOVED learning, but school.. I hated. I didn't want or need to know about the spanish armada and sedemantary rocks etc! By the time I was in year 6 of primary school, I had worked my way up to year 9 secondary school maths text books, then when I went to secondary school the teachers wondered why I didn't want to sit and do all this crap over again! So I didn't, I did no coursework, sat and chatted in lessons simply because nothing at school tested my mind or interested me! (I did love the look on the teachers faces when they found I passed 10 GCSE's at A to C after giving birth the day before the exams started tho ) They even made me sit an official IQ test to 'get to the bottom of my behaviour problems' and when they found that it was 169, which got me into MENSA, still didn't do anything about it and made me sit through the same lessons!! I then didn't go to college or university because I honestly could not bear it after all the years of school! I'm sure had I been educated at home, things would have been very different!

This is my thinking. I was really badly bullied at school and ended up leaving at 14 due to this. I am now a mother and part of my being mother is to protect my children, I see school as a threat. If I can avoid my children having to deal with the heart ache, emotional and mental problems I have due to my schooling experience I will. Unfortunately DH isn't too pleased with the idea of home schooling (although it would actually be child led rather than structured home learning) he had a great time at school and used it alot as his social time rather than to gain an education and qualifications. This probably makes no sense but basically what I'm trying to say is sometimes "normal" school doesn't suit a child or a child doesn't suit "normal" school iygwim?