woolwich

[lilyd]

By saying it is an Islamist attack as many (not neccesarily on here) seem to be, it indicates that they did it because they are Muslim, rather than because they are two sick men that (may, don't even know if it's the case) happen to be Muslim.

Linking it to the Islamic faith does a massive disservice to the vast majority of other Muslims in this country who are just as horrified as the vast majority of non Muslims are.

I can't abide discrimination of any kind, yet find it strange that some forms are acceptable. A few weeks ago when Margaret Thatcher died, I read 'I fucking hate Tories' on FB & I have seen 'I hate all coppers' on more than one occasion. I find it completely odd that you can show hatred towards somebody for their political beliefs or their job, yet other forms of discrimination are illegal.

 

[smileyfaces]

It's a bit of a moot point but there is no indication from anywhere the soldier was actually beheaded. Even the woman who spoke to both knife men and stood very close to the body said he had been badly stabbed but not beheaded. It doesn't really matter it's still appalling but a lot of people are running off with the whole 'beheaded' angle as proof this was a terrorist action when it doesn't appear to be true xx

No one is using the speculation of decapitation as proof of terrorism? What a ridiculous thing to say. Either way the crime is EQUALLY as horrific.

People are arguing terrorism because (1) The media seem to be using this as an excuse, (2) The inner racist and xenophobe in a lot of people has been exposed and when people start to blame a persons religion or race it quickly turns into an act of terrorism.

Whether or not he was beheaded does not give amunition to speculate terrorism and it certainly doesn't give people 'proof' that it was a terror attack.

 

[summer rain]

There were lots of people on twitter saying because this soldier was beheaded (which there is no proof of) then it was definitely a terrorist attack in the vein of Iraq on that basis xx

 

[Missy86]

By saying it is an Islamist attack as many (not neccesarily on here) seem to be, it indicates that they did it because they are Muslim, rather than because they are two sick men that (may, don't even know if it's the case) happen to be Muslim.

Linking it to the Islamic faith does a massive disservice to the vast majority of other Muslims in this country who are just as horrified as the vast majority of non Muslims are.

I can't abide discrimination of any kind, yet find it strange that some forms are acceptable. A few weeks ago when Margaret Thatcher died, I read 'I fucking hate Tories' on FB & I have seen 'I hate all coppers' on more than one occasion. I find it completely odd that you can show hatred towards somebody for their political beliefs or their job, yet other forms of discrimination are illegal.

I totally agree, I think people in some areas of society are sheep that just want to blame everyone else

I mean in the August 2011 riots most people didn't know what they were rioting about they just did it for the hell of it

 

[smileyfaces]

There were lots of people on twitter saying because this soldier was beheaded (which there is no proof of) then it was definitely a terrorist attack in the vein of Iraq on that basis xx

Seriously?! Wow.

With regards to the speculation on whether or not he was beheaded, I have read on various news reports that witnesses had noted that his head had been 'hacked off'.

But, as always, can you believe what you read in the media?

 

[louandivy]

By saying it is an Islamist attack as many (not neccesarily on here) seem to be, it indicates that they did it because they are Muslim, rather than because they are two sick men that (may, don't even know if it's the case) happen to be Muslim.

Linking it to the Islamic faith does a massive disservice to the vast majority of other Muslims in this country who are just as horrified as the vast majority of non Muslims are.

I can't abide discrimination of any kind, yet find it strange that some forms are acceptable. A few weeks ago when Margaret Thatcher died, I read 'I fucking hate Tories' on FB & I have seen 'I hate all coppers' on more than one occasion. I find it completely odd that you can show hatred towards somebody for their political beliefs or their job, yet other forms of discrimination are illegal.

While I do agree in principle, I don't really think saying 'I hate Tories' and 'I hate Muslims' is comparable because Tories do not deal with the same level of discrimination and hatred. Plus often Islamophobia is mainly just rooted in pure racism and a distrust of people who 'look foreign', which is obviously out of a person's control.

 

[smileyfaces]

I am getting fed up of the number of people on my facebook posting ridiculous links now and making idiotic status's about this. Some people are now raving about the bnp?! Arrrghhh!!! They all need a bloody education!

 

[lilyd]

By saying it is an Islamist attack as many (not neccesarily on here) seem to be, it indicates that they did it because they are Muslim, rather than because they are two sick men that (may, don't even know if it's the case) happen to be Muslim.

Linking it to the Islamic faith does a massive disservice to the vast majority of other Muslims in this country who are just as horrified as the vast majority of non Muslims are.

I can't abide discrimination of any kind, yet find it strange that some forms are acceptable. A few weeks ago when Margaret Thatcher died, I read 'I fucking hate Tories' on FB & I have seen 'I hate all coppers' on more than one occasion. I find it completely odd that you can show hatred towards somebody for their political beliefs or their job, yet other forms of discrimination are illegal.

While I do agree in principle, I don't really think saying 'I hate Tories' and 'I hate Muslims' is comparable because Tories do not deal with the same level of discrimination and hatred. Plus often Islamophobia is mainly just rooted in pure racism and a distrust of people who 'look foreign', which is obviously out of a person's control.

Totally agree, I just think some people can be quite hypocritical about dicrimination and think it's ok to do it in some forms but not others.

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

I have loads on mine smiley I just ignore them. Its hard where I live as we are not surrounded by many different cultures and people tend to have one sided views.
Sad but true.
I think most of the speculation comes from what the attacker says himself in the video.

 

[summer rain]

There were lots of people on twitter saying because this soldier was beheaded (which there is no proof of) then it was definitely a terrorist attack in the vein of Iraq on that basis xx

Seriously?! Wow.

With regards to the speculation on whether or not he was beheaded, I have read on various news reports that witnesses had noted that his head had been 'hacked off'.

But, as always, can you believe what you read in the media?

The witnesses on the scene at the time were reporting completely different things than those coming out of the woodwork claiming they had witnessed it later on. I don't take 'eyewitness' statements too seriously since Jean Charles de Menezes, there were several 'eyewitnesses' then who claimed he was wearing a smoking backpack with wires sticking out of it and that he was shouting 'Allaahu Akbar' look how true that turned out to be. There were people on the scene in Woolwich from the start who saw these false witnesses turn up as late as two hours later and start saying all sorts about what alledgedly happened. Xx

 

[R_x]

Sure it was said they attempted to behead him i don't think they actually got it off but the evidence will be there

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

The itv news did say about his head I think

 

[Pearls18]

I’m a hearing a lot of “we need a back bone” “what are we going to do about this” “we need to make a stand” etc and many people are making it sound like it was avoidable, like our culture or government was somehow to blame, genuine question but why are people reacting like this? What do they think we should do differently? Is it because there have been extremist demonstrations and that doesn’t affect their residency? Genuinely asking not trying to make a point.

 

[summer rain]

It was also said at first they shot him, not stabbed. The latest versions of news stories on it are no longer saying that he was beheaded or even this was attempted. I don't trust ITV news they said the men were of 'Muslim appearance' which presumably in this case means having darker skin because there was nothing else remarkably Muslim looking about them. Imagine if the news said a Jewish guy was of 'Jewish appearance' or the soldier who was killed was of 'Christian appearance'? It would not go unquestioned xx

 

[bumpy_j]

So true summer rain. Andres Breivik killed 77 people in a highly organised way, was subsequently considered not to be insane and was sentenced accordingly. He had links to the hierarchy of far-right groups and wrote an enourmous manifesto on the indoctrination of Europe. When is the last time you heard him called a terrorist?

Two guys killed a man in a crazed manner - nothing concrete about them has been confirmed and suddenly it's "terrorists! terrorists everywhere!"

I don't see how noticing the hypocrisy and dismaying at people trying to use this tragedy to get others to sympathise with far right parties is in anyway justifying this tragedy. Frankly I find it mind boggling that anyone would come to that conclusion.

 

[Jchihuahua]

I dont there is any excuse either religion or insanity. I do however think its wrong he was preaching his views (if true) in the town centre! I just seems anytime a crime like this is made that anyone calling the attacker scum is a muslim hating racist!? I dont agree with the extreme hate posts on fb but I honestly think they are evil scum and don't deserve human rights tbh!?

And why did no-one call the police and report these men if they were indeed preaching in the town centre (though I do have friends in Woolwich and they have never seen these men before)? The police would take action. I have reported some Al Muhajiroun sympathisers to the police before they had a paltalk room operating from London and Luton and action was taken against the perpetrators immediately and their room was closed down. Unfortunately in London people tend to turn a blind eye to these things and then claim the police won't do anything when this isn't the case xx

There are often preachers in Woolwich. I lived there ten years and go back regularly. I have seen them many times as I'm sure many others from Woolwich would agree with. The police are aware of them. I have actually complained in the past myself to a PCSO on the street as what they said was offensive. I recognised that man as someone I am pretty sure I have seen. I said it as soon as I saw the footage and before I'd heard anyone else say the same. They preach some horrible things and the vast majority of people who hear them know very well they are sick individuals and in no way whatsoever represent Islam and the massive majority of Muslims. They are sick extremists who represent Islam about as much as the klu kux klan represent Christianity.

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

With regards to the shot thing, I think they got confused with the attackers being shot if you know what I mean x

 

[louandivy]

So true summer rain. Andres Breivik killed 77 people in a highly organised way, was subsequently considered not to be insane and was sentenced accordingly. He had links to the hierarchy of far-right groups and wrote an enourmous manifesto on the indoctrination of Europe. When is the last time you heard him called a terrorist?

Two guys killed a man in a crazed manner - nothing concrete about them has been confirmed and suddenly it's "terrorists! terrorists everywhere!"

I don't see how noticing the hypocrisy and dismaying at people trying to use this tragedy to get others to sympathise with far right parties is in anyway justifying this tragedy. Frankly I find it mind boggling that anyone would come to that conclusion.

MTEEEEEEEE its so frustrating. And people who are saying that it can't be insanity and must be terrorism because there were 2 people involved - what about the Columbine shootings? I don't believe those 2 white Americans were ever labelled as terrorists.

 

[summer rain]

By the way two weeks ago in Birmingham an elderly defenceless Muslim man of Pakistani origin was set upon and stabbed with a machete or similar, possibly by more than one individual in what police believe to be a racially and religiously motivated and planned attack as he was coming out of the mosque at the time. He was stabbed so brutally that they put whatever blade they used right through his body, yet this story has barely made the newspapers and was only briefly on the TV news. It could well have been organised far right behaviour but no suggestion has been made of it being terrorism or extremism in any way xx

 

[summer rain]

I dont there is any excuse either religion or insanity. I do however think its wrong he was preaching his views (if true) in the town centre! I just seems anytime a crime like this is made that anyone calling the attacker scum is a muslim hating racist!? I dont agree with the extreme hate posts on fb but I honestly think they are evil scum and don't deserve human rights tbh!?

And why did no-one call the police and report these men if they were indeed preaching in the town centre (though I do have friends in Woolwich and they have never seen these men before)? The police would take action. I have reported some Al Muhajiroun sympathisers to the police before they had a paltalk room operating from London and Luton and action was taken against the perpetrators immediately and their room was closed down. Unfortunately in London people tend to turn a blind eye to these things and then claim the police won't do anything when this isn't the case xx

There are often preachers in Woolwich. I lived there ten years and go back regularly. I have seen them many times as I'm sure many others from Woolwich would agree with. The police are aware of them. I have actually complained in the past myself to a PCSO on the street as what they said was offensive. I recognised that man as someone I am pretty sure I have seen. I said it as soon as I saw the footage and before I'd heard anyone else say the same. They preach some horrible things and the vast majority of people who hear them know very well they are sick individuals and in no way whatsoever represent Islam and the massive majority of Muslims. They are sick extremists who represent Islam about as much as the klu kux klan represent Christianity.

PCSOs can't do anything you need to go into or phone a police station to report it. Innocent law abiding peaceful Muslims have had their information stalls closed down by police after complaints from the public so I am sure these people would have their stalls closed down too if enough complaints were made xx