Do you think CC/CIO is wrong?

[TennisGal]

That's interesting, light worker- thanks. We do now co-sleep, with Lizzie coming into us in the v early morning to finish off her sleep with mummy and daddy!

I don't think I really expected Lizzie to sleep through until she had self weaned (17.5 months), but even then I wasn't sure! She ended up going with full nights a good bit before that.

 

[PepsiChic]

I dont agree with CC or CIO.

I believe people should try alternative methods first such as no cry solution or PUPD. I used PUPD when my LO was 4 months. Is it hard work? yes of course but it meant that he wasnt left to cry for longer then a minute or two. Ive helped multiple people on this forum with it via 1 on 1 pms.

I find it quite upsetting that people jump straight to things like CC and CIO rather then find a more nurturing way to aid there babys sleep.

I also think that many people have their expectations too high for their babies, multiple times i see people saying "my baby doesnt STTN" and when i see their tickers babies of 4-12 months old I also give a sad sigh...most babies dont STTN till after 12 months of age, and no matter what sleep "training" you do, nothing will change that.

so why try and force them with sleep training that involves crying and being alone for periods of time? rather then trying something more calming first keeping in mind that, things will improve...but your baby WONT STTN every single night.

 

[moomin_troll]

zane didnt sleep thru till he was just over a yr and a half, it was hard but that was him. we coslept till he didnt want to anymore at 6 months and he went into his cot....i hated it lol

with baby 2 im hoping he will STTN but im not counting on it and nor will i have a heart attack about it if he doesnt.
i dont think anyone can really have children and expect it to be easy and that they will get the same amount of sleep as before

 

[caggimedicine]

I think it would be a great shame if Lena left - she contributes a great deal to this forum. If everyone like her left, this forum would be left with posts just about hair / make up / facebook photos / plastic surgery etc etc.

I also think it's also a shame that people can't have a debate in the debate section!

 

[Lightworker]

In another debate of the same nature, I made the comparison to an older child. If I left my pre-schooler to cry deliberately, as far as child protection officers are concerned, I would not be meeting that emotional need. Those against CC/CIO believe that cuddles, need to be close to mom etc are all legitimate emotional (some even argue physiological) needs and thats why they cannot reconcile themselves to the notion of allowing a baby to cry, even though pro-CC justify it as being for the purpose of sleep

 

[justlove]

Personally for me i'm not comfortable with the CIO whilst they are babies, i tend to my LO every whim for me this is what works and im perfectly happy doing, its hard to sit back and say nothing to my lil sis as she does do the CIO but end of day its her who has to tend to her kids everyday and thats what works for her.

However I had no qualms about sending my stroppy overtired teenager to her bedroom few weeks back to cry it out lol

 

[angel2010]

In another debate of the same nature, I made the comparison to an older child. If I left my pre-schooler to cry deliberately, as far as child protection officers are concerned, I would not be meeting that emotional need. Those against CC/CIO believe that cuddles, need to be close to mom etc are all legitimate emotional (some even argue physiological) needs and thats why they cannot reconcile themselves to the notion of allowing a baby to cry, even though pro-CC justify it as being for the purpose of sleep

I am not a fan of cc or cio, but in regards to older children- older children can manipulate unlike babies/toddlers.

 

[TennisGal]

Just as an aside regarding the giving of opinions in debates. There are ways of doing this in a mature and sensitively worded fashion. Far too often, posts can come across at best sanctimonious and at worst down right rude. How can calling someone an idiot or comparing things to training a dog be construed as constructive or mature? If I did this in 'real life', I'd have few friends and probably no job.

If anyone comes to a thread like this looking for advice, I can but imagine how they would feel. I don't agree with CIO, but I would never make such harsh statements, as how on earth do I know anything about the situation?! I hardly think it's a decision the parents take lightly.

I prefer to offer alternatives and support-not cast the first stone. We are supposed to be here to support, yet sometimes it feels like the opposite.

People can get opinions across in very strong and firm ways without resorting to rudeness and/or smugness.

And I refer also to calling someone a 'joke'-how would anyone feel if that was directed at them? I've got pretty thick skin, but I hate rudeness. Strong opinions...great. Rudeness...not so.

 

[brunette&bubs]

Just as an aside regarding the giving of opinions in debates. There are ways of doing this in a mature and sensitively worded fashion. Far too often, posts can come across at best sanctimonious and at worst down right rude. How can calling someone an idiot or comparing things to training a dog be construed as constructive or mature? If I did this in 'real life', I'd have few friends and probably no job.

If anyone comes to a thread like this looking for advice, I can but imagine how they would feel. I don't agree with CIO, but I would never say such harsh statements, as how on earth do I know anything about their situation?! I hardly think it's a decision the parents take lightly.

I prefer to offer alternatives and support-not cast the first stone. We are supposed to be here to support, yet sometimes it feels like the opposite.

People can get opinions across in very strong and firm ways without resorting to rudeness and/or smugness.

And I refer also to calling someone a 'joke'-how would anyone feel if that was directed at them? I've got pretty thick skin, but I hate rudeness. Strong opinions...great. Rudeness...not so.

LOVE this statement.
I feel like neglect is a hurtful word...acting as if I should be reported to SS.
So I'm a bad mom now for taking away my sons pacifier at 5 months? So be it. I really don't see it that way.

Why can't people just be respectful?
I honestly could care less how anyone else mothers as long as their child is not in danger...I will parent my way and if someone else does something a different way it is not my place to insult them.

it would be like if i went to a thread about Formula Feeding and said...
"FF moms are lazy"

or into a thread talking about a mom who weaned at 4 months and said,
"you're an idiot for early weaning"

(BTW these statements are just examples, not how i feel)
its just rude and inappropriate

there is a way of saying your opinion without being downright rude!

 

[Lightworker]

Its not the same as going to an FF forum and saying something unsolicited. You specifically asked for opinions so it is abit different. When you say you don't care how other people parent unless their children were in danger, well alot of people who are aginst CC/CIO base their opinions on research which shows that there is emotional and physiological damage done during the CC/CIO, and perhaps long term as well. So to them, that child is in danger, which is why they care, just as you said you would.

 

[brunette&bubs]

Its not the same as going to an FF forum and saying something unsolicited. You specifically asked for opinions so it is abit different. When you say you don't care how other people parent unless their children were in danger, well alot of people who are aginst CC/CIO base their opinions on research which shows that there is emotional and physiological damage done during the CC/CIO, and perhaps long term as well. So to them, that child is in danger, which is why they care, just as you said you would.

there's a difference between constructive and useful opinions and jabs that are said that is just hurtful.

okay lightworker, handcuff me and send me to child protective services for putting my son "in danger".
i have failed as a mother by taking my sons pacifier away and letting him fuss for 3 minutes.

 

[angel2010]

I dont agree with CC or CIO.

I believe people should try alternative methods first such as no cry solution or PUPD. I used PUPD when my LO was 4 months. Is it hard work? yes of course but it meant that he wasnt left to cry for longer then a minute or two. Ive helped multiple people on this forum with it via 1 on 1 pms.

I find it quite upsetting that people jump straight to things like CC and CIO rather then find a more nurturing way to aid there babys sleep.

I also think that many people have their expectations too high for their babies, multiple times i see people saying "my baby doesnt STTN" and when i see their tickers babies of 4-12 months old I also give a sad sigh...most babies dont STTN till after 12 months of age, and no matter what sleep "training" you do, nothing will change that.

so why try and force them with sleep training that involves crying and being alone for periods of time? rather then trying something more calming first keeping in mind that, things will improve...but your baby WONT STTN every single night.

Kirsty, I hope you don't mind me using you as an example

Pepsichic may feel that cc/cio is neglectful, but she didn't say so in such a rude/offensive way. She said that she doesn't agree with it and went on to say what she thinks should be done instead.
There are ways to put your opinion across without being offensive, escpecially when in situations like cc/cio you can never know all the details.

Disclaimer, I am not a fan of cc/cio and *****I am not saying Pepsi thinks it is neglectful, it is just an example of how you can be nicer.*****

 

[brunette&bubs]

I dont agree with CC or CIO.

I believe people should try alternative methods first such as no cry solution or PUPD. I used PUPD when my LO was 4 months. Is it hard work? yes of course but it meant that he wasnt left to cry for longer then a minute or two. Ive helped multiple people on this forum with it via 1 on 1 pms.

I find it quite upsetting that people jump straight to things like CC and CIO rather then find a more nurturing way to aid there babys sleep.

I also think that many people have their expectations too high for their babies, multiple times i see people saying "my baby doesnt STTN" and when i see their tickers babies of 4-12 months old I also give a sad sigh...most babies dont STTN till after 12 months of age, and no matter what sleep "training" you do, nothing will change that.

so why try and force them with sleep training that involves crying and being alone for periods of time? rather then trying something more calming first keeping in mind that, things will improve...but your baby WONT STTN every single night.

Kirsty, I hope you don't mind me using you as an example

Pepsichic may feel that cc/cio is neglectful, but she didn't say so in such a rude/offensive way. She said that she doesn't agree with it and went on to say what she thinks should be done instead.
There are ways to put your opinion across without being offensive, escpecially when in situations like cc/cio you can never know all the details.

Disclaimer, I am not a fan of cc/cio and *****I am not saying Pepsi thinks it is neglectful, it is just an example of how you can be nicer.*****

Exactly!
I appreciate hearing peoples opinions when they are civil about it.
But when people start being insulting and basically insinuating that i am a bad mom
Well.....that's when momma bear comes out!

 

[PepsiChic]

Its not the same as going to an FF forum and saying something unsolicited. You specifically asked for opinions so it is abit different. When you say you don't care how other people parent unless their children were in danger, well alot of people who are aginst CC/CIO base their opinions on research which shows that there is emotional and physiological damage done during the CC/CIO, and perhaps long term as well. So to them, that child is in danger, which is why they care, just as you said you would.

there's a difference between constructive and useful opinions and jabs that are said that is just hurtful.

okay lightworker, handcuff me and send me to child protective services for putting my son "in danger".
i have failed as a mother by taking my sons pacifier away and letting him fuss for 3 minutes.

Its true this could of been put in a better way.

I dont agree in CIO/CC because research shows that it can be detrimental to a babys health. research shows that when a baby cries for a period of time it releases a stress hormone called cortisol into the babys brain, which can affect emotional development. and has been shown to make toddlers more aggressive.

I do infact suggest any parent choosing to do CC or CIO looks up this research as its very interesting and one of the main reason i choose not to do it (as well as the fact that i dont like to hear LO cry)

and while you may not really like what lightworker said...there is some truth to it, your not a bad mum at all...but you must realize that there are no real benefits to doing CC and that there are better alternatives like PUPD.

 

[Lightworker]

Angel- yeah definitely, we should all try to be polite and tactful. On News and Debates what I tend to notice is that people (well me) come here to actively debate something, so when we are offering our take on things, it is usually followed by an explanation/research etc, so not always will one offer an alternative iywkim? Most will focus on backing up their own views. Its the sparring of a debate that I think people like when they come here. X

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

I don't see cc as neglect, you are not just leaving them to cry you are going in at short intervals to soothe and comfort your child. In my work I have seen emotional neglect, the children are withdrawn, easily upset, quite and very timid. They lack social skills and the bond between them and the care given is visably poor e.g. if they are hurt they withdraw from affection

Whereas my son (who I used CC with) is a virbant, chatty, independant, happy and outgoing little boy. But if he is upset he always comes to me/asks for me. His soical skils are brilliant for his age and his emotional development has not been affected. x

 

[moomin_troll]

my son has always been hugged within a inch of his life lol but he still just tried to punch me because he didnt want a bath and decided to cry and told me mummy im crying. i still left him in his bedroom to go run his bath.

we cant always hug our children everytime they cry and sometimes we just need to have a massive cry by ourselves, which sometimes is what my son wants to do (im commenting on older children here not a baby)

 

[stardust599]

Interesting read for anyone looking to feel reassured about CC. Read write to the bottom where it mentions the studies done on CC.

https://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/774928.html

 

[KittyVentura]

There are definitely ways to say what you think and to get your point across without being rude.

The words "just my opinion" or "in my opinion" never make it ok to say something that you KNOW will offend and upset many people. Even on a debates section. We're here to debate, not to share harsh lines to put down those with an oposing view.

I'm going to use an extreme example to make my point here. The example is NOT my opinion and is not what I think. I use it because I know it's something that those defending the rudeness in this post would find offensive if it was genuinely said and meant.

This came from a comment I saw on the Daily Mail site (Oh the joy that is the daily mail).

So, would those that feel that giving their opinion should be ok, even if it offends others. Would you defend that right if you saw this commented as a one liner on a debate thread?

"Women that breast feed are disgusting and are perverting their children. In my opinion it is no better than paedophilia"

... or, because it is now you and your parenting choice that has been targetted, would you welcome moderator action?

Whoever posted it may be able to explain why they feel this, just as Lightworker has done. ETA - Lightworker didn't offend the way Lena did. I mention LW because she has explained the view of it being neglect

Just trying to help emphasise my point. Again, to clarify. That is not my view AT ALL. I think BF is beautiful and wish every day that I had suceeded at it. I am also not a CC/CIO supporter as such. I just do not share the same extreme opposition as many others xx

 

[brunette&bubs]

Brunette&Bubs- I hope you don't mind me asking, but why did you feel you had to say that? Did you feel I was judging you?

i feel like the things you are saying could be worded better.
you are saying things that are very offensive to me.
and although this was MOVED to news & debates (originally posted in baby club) I was not looking for insulting comments...
constructive opinions are fine and I enjoy reading them

i.e. PepsiChic does not agree with CC but has not once insulted me.