formula in the uk vs us

[summer rain]

The reason for the guideline is because with the two methods used by manufacturers worldwide to make liquid formula into powder, there is a small but potentially lethal risk of dangerous food poisoning bugs making their way into the finished products. This risk is found in the US as well and some babies have died in the US in the past due to such contamination. The only reason why making up with cooled boiled water isn't advised in the US is because there is a strong formula marketing lobby and it wouldn't be good for business if they mentioned such potential risks on their packaging plus they'd have to spend millions reformulating and repackaging their product to be reconstituted with hotter water. Most formulas in the UK were reformulated in this way 5 years or so ago so that any nutrients will be little affected by the hotter water temperature and they are now not designed to be mixed with room temp water xx

 

[Duejan2012]

so if that happend in the uk then why when there have been infants the havnt gotten sick or even worse some died from so called bacteria in the formula but those batches only get recalled. Why dont they tell us that this was happening so now they are putting another warning on the can to prevent this from happening? Does that make sense. I think if this was truely the case and it prevented these acasional sick babies why wouldnt they put it on. I personally wont care if it said to do it or not. Whatever it said on the can as a warning then i would follow that. Even if it ment boiling and cooling and sterilizing etc I dont think it would change people minds about useing formula therefore the business wouldnt be ruined. All i would care about is my baby being healthy no matter what it took.

 

[andella95]

I've been trying to find actual cases of this happening, so pehaps someone could point me to a verified recent source of this. I'm sure it's somewhere, but I can't find it, lol. There was the enfamil scare last year, but the problem wasn't a batch of contaminated formula.

I know that everyone wants to hate on the formula companies, but I'm finding that a lot of it is conspiracy theory instead of fact.

Do you really think that people would stop using formula and start breastfeeding if we were told to boil and sterlilize? Nope. If they were really too lazy, they'd start using concentrate or ready to feed which are already sterile and cost MORE money, so the formula company's would make more profit.

 

[queenlavera]

Andella - I agree with you, the formula companies would stand to make more money because more people would buy the ready to feed or concentrate to not have to worry about bacteria in powder and they are definitely more expensive. I also have not found any actual sources showing that babies have died from bacteria in formula.

I am still confused with the boiling than cooling to kill bacteria in the formula itself, how are you always sure that the temp is 70 degrees after the 30 minute wait period and how do you quickly make a bottle if you have to do this? Also wouldn't different weather make the water temp lower or higher.

 

[fairykate]

Andella - I agree with you, the formula companies would stand to make more money because more people would buy the ready to feed or concentrate to not have to worry about bacteria in powder and they are definitely more expensive. I also have not found any actual sources showing that babies have died from bacteria in formula.

I am still confused with the boiling than cooling to kill bacteria in the formula itself, how are you always sure that the temp is 70 degrees after the 30 minute wait period and how do you quickly make a bottle if you have to do this? Also wouldn't different weather make the water temp lower or higher.

The weather wouldn't make a difference as you're inside and the water is in the kettle so I don't see how it would affect it?

I imagine that they must have tested a range of kettles and timed the water to see when it reached the right temp. They haven't just made it up to make our lives more difficult - it would have had proper testing over some years as there are so many rules and regulations for baby formula.

It is difficult to make a bottle 'quickly' but what I do is to keep a jug of boiled, COLD water in the fridge at all times which I top up when I use it. I then boil the kettle, get the bottle ready (put it together or whatever) and mix the right amount of powder with HALF the amount of 'just off the boil' water, mix, then add the remaining oz of the cold water from the fridge and this cools it down. Takes about 5mins. You know roughly when your baby will want another feed anyway tbh.

 

[Duejan2012]

well i remember reading in third tri about a case where a 10 week old baby died supposivly because of the formula having bactiera in it. All they did was recall that batch and did test but NEVER found anything in the formula. It was enfamil new born i believe. But just like i said in prev post that it doesnt matter what the can said i will be feeding my baby. Andella said it better about that wouldnt stop us from formula feeding our babies. And that was a perfect point about the concentrate too.

ALso i wonder how big is the scoop in uk vs usa because they said that in ukk its one scoop per one ounce or something?

edit i meant 10 day old baby lol

 

[mommyof3co]

From what I understand it's not the formula that's different but the water, apparently here in the US our water is better controlled and filtered. I think I remember seeing that the UK doesn't have fluoride in their water but we do...or the other way around? I can't remember now haha. But I'm pretty sure it's how our water is treated vs theirs. When I've used formula with some of my kids I never boiled first, I did sterilize bottles probably once a week but washed with hot soapy water between that

 

[fairykate]

well i remember reading in third tri about a case where a 10 week old baby died supposivly because of the formula having bactiera in it. All they did was recall that batch and did test but NEVER found anything in the formula. It was enfamil new born i believe. But just like i said in prev post that it doesnt matter what the can said i will be feeding my baby. Andella said it better about that wouldnt stop us from formula feeding our babies. And that was a perfect point about the concentrate too.

ALso i wonder how big is the scoop in uk vs usa because they said that in ukk its one scoop per one ounce or something?

Our scoops are 4.5g or 5g.....? Not sure what yours are over there, might say on the packet though?

 

[queenlavera]

Andella - I agree with you, the formula companies would stand to make more money because more people would buy the ready to feed or concentrate to not have to worry about bacteria in powder and they are definitely more expensive. I also have not found any actual sources showing that babies have died from bacteria in formula.

I am still confused with the boiling than cooling to kill bacteria in the formula itself, how are you always sure that the temp is 70 degrees after the 30 minute wait period and how do you quickly make a bottle if you have to do this? Also wouldn't different weather make the water temp lower or higher.

The weather wouldn't make a difference as you're inside and the water is in the kettle so I don't see how it would affect it?

I imagine that they must have tested a range of kettles and timed the water to see when it reached the right temp. They haven't just made it up to make our lives more difficult - it would have had proper testing over some years as there are so many rules and regulations for baby formula.

It is difficult to make a bottle 'quickly' but what I do is to keep a jug of boiled, COLD water in the fridge at all times which I top up when I use it. I then boil the kettle, get the bottle ready (put it together or whatever) and mix the right amount of powder with HALF the amount of 'just off the boil' water, mix, then add the remaining oz of the cold water from the fridge and this cools it down. Takes about 5mins. You know roughly when your baby will want another feed anyway tbh.

I believe it is a water issue, not a formula one that is my point. Also I don't know about in your home but mine is colder in the winter and hotter in the summer, so the water would cool to a different temp during those times. This is what I am talking about.
It is interesting to see how you have to prepare yours, I just use filtered water.

 

[queenlavera]

From what I have been able to find, it seems the bacteria issue (which has not been proven to be because of formula) is a problem for babies 10 days old and younger. So I am wondering would those steps still be necessary for an older baby?

 

[Duejan2012]

From what I have been able to find, it seems the bacteria issue (which has not been proven to be because of formula) is a problem for babies 10 days old and younger. So I am wondering would those steps still be necessary for an older baby?

That is true i never thought about that? i wonder how that would work? but its like you said. That it was never proven that it was caused because of a bacteria in the formula. I guess it could be the water in uk vs usa but dont they have bottled water over there or filters?

 

[Duejan2012]

well i remember reading in third tri about a case where a 10 week old baby died supposivly because of the formula having bactiera in it. All they did was recall that batch and did test but NEVER found anything in the formula. It was enfamil new born i believe. But just like i said in prev post that it doesnt matter what the can said i will be feeding my baby. Andella said it better about that wouldnt stop us from formula feeding our babies. And that was a perfect point about the concentrate too.

ALso i wonder how big is the scoop in uk vs usa because they said that in ukk its one scoop per one ounce or something?

Our scoops are 4.5g or 5g.....? Not sure what yours are over there, might say on the packet though?

here it is 1 scoop to 2 oz of water 2 scoops to 4 etc.... not sure exactly how big they are though

There is another post on the first page that a lady said that there its 1 scoop to 1 oz etc

 

[aliss]

We are supposed to boil/sterilize here in North America (hey, Canada too!! ) however, it is a very widely ignored rule and I have never met a mom in NA who actually has done those things. I wonder if having dishwashers as a standard has something to do with it.

 

[summer rain]

From what I have been able to find, it seems the bacteria issue (which has not been proven to be because of formula) is a problem for babies 10 days old and younger. So I am wondering would those steps still be necessary for an older baby?

That is true i never thought about that? i wonder how that would work? but its like you said. That it was never proven that it was caused because of a bacteria in the formula. I guess it could be the water in uk vs usa but dont they have bottled water over there or filters?

The bacteria can be an issue for babies of any age should it have multiplied enough in the powder, also the enterobacter/chronobacter strain in question is found almost exclusively in infant formula. While in a recent case in the US it wasn't proven the formula was the source of illness which caused a baby's death in other cases it has been proven. And there have been product recalls in the past due to the prescence of such bacteria being found when formula has been batch tested.

Bottled water is not sterile, so isn't safe for babies and the bottled water in the Uk comes from natural springs and so has a high mineral content, again making it unsafe. Filtered water is also unsafe as the filters harbour bacteria, and anyway a filter does nothing to kill germs just to remove certain mineral deposits and chemicals from the water in question.

 

[summer rain]

I'm on my phone right now but if you google formula recalls it will tell you all the recalls due to prescence of enterobacter sakazakii and other bacteria but testing processes are not perfect and the potential is there for bad batches to slip through. Also google enterobacter sakazakii and infant formula and a lot of strongly credible links about the risks, including pages from the US government and FDA come up. While their advice on dealing with this problem differs from that in the UK, it doesn't mean they don't think there is a serious potential risk from these bacteria. The advice in the UK was decided on after the government and formula companies did their own studies and risk assessments. Also the UK tap water is amongst the safest in the world possibly safer than the US water but bottom line is no tap water is sterile and the pipes etc that it comes into your house through there is no way of ensuring those are
sterile either.

 

[andella95]

I think that maybe its just because it so rare which is why is not widely publicized here???

"Since 1958, 120 cases of Cronobacter infection in infants have been reported, an average of fewer than three cases per year worldwide."

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5842a3.htm

https://www.businessweek.com/news/2...by-s-death-linked-to-formula-since-1980s.html

 

[queenlavera]

Another question to be able to put apples to apples, does UK formula cans for brands such as Enfamil, Gerber or Similiac say to boil the water. We don't have Cow and Gate here which did have on their website to boil the water.

Because the way it is sounding is that the formula companies care more about UK children than US and that doesn't really make much sense. Why would UK be given extra safety instructions but not to US? I am thinking formula companies care about the bottom line and if they were killing off US children it wouldn't really be good for business.

 

[vintage67]

You can scare monger all you like about bacteria in water, bacteria in formula, etc., etc. It's a toxic world. What do you suppose breastfeeding mothers are eating and drinking and passing on? Differing levels of prescription drugs have been found in the municipal water supplies in major cities, mostly antidepressants. As well as metals and all sorts of things.

Nothing is 100% safe. Not formula. Not breastmilk. Not eating. Not breathing.

 

[darkangel1981]

Another question to be able to put apples to apples, does UK formula cans for brands such as Enfamil, Gerber or Similiac say to boil the water. We don't have Cow and Gate here which did have on their website to boil the water.

Because the way it is sounding is that the formula companies care more about UK children than US and that doesn't really make much sense. Why would UK be given extra safety instructions but not to US? I am thinking formula companies care about the bottom line and if they were killing off US children it wouldn't really be good for business.

all uk formula states to do this except for SMA staydown i think. Ands its to do with the who guidelines not our water. In scotland we have some of the best tap water in the world (boasting much?? lol)

 

[queenlavera]

Another question to be able to put apples to apples, does UK formula cans for brands such as Enfamil, Gerber or Similiac say to boil the water. We don't have Cow and Gate here which did have on their website to boil the water.

Because the way it is sounding is that the formula companies care more about UK children than US and that doesn't really make much sense. Why would UK be given extra safety instructions but not to US? I am thinking formula companies care about the bottom line and if they were killing off US children it wouldn't really be good for business.

all uk formula states to do this except for SMA staydown i think. Ands its to do with the who guidelines not our water. In scotland we have some of the best tap water in the world (boasting much?? lol)

Yes, the WHO guidelines are for multiple countries some who may not have the best tap water in the world. So it would give the most stringent instructions for preparing formula, it may not be a water issue for the UK but for some of the other countries it is. Oh and it is totally ok to boast, I believe the US does everything better. No problem with being patriotic!

I follow the US FDA instructions which states to follow doctor instructions re: boiling, due to my LO being a full term healthy baby, boiling is not necessary for us. Summer rain, I was also telling Fairykate just what type of water I use, not that I thought it was better than any other. I pay for monthly bottled water deliveries so that is what I use. Thanks for the lesson on filters though.

This conversation has been interesting and I have wondered about the difference for a little while.