formula in the uk vs us

[summer rain]

Queenlavera I was more saying about the bottled water and filters in response to 'duejan' who was wondering if we did not have these things in the UK; we do but the bottled water for the most part has a high mineral content and is advised by the government as not being suitable for babies (and not just for mixing with formula but just on its own or mixed with juice also), and water filters sold here specifically say on their packaging or that of the filters to be used in them not to use the water for young babies or children or other vulnerable people because the filter has so many nooks and crannies and can harbour bacteria which can be harmful for vulnerable groups, though would be harmless for older kids and adults. I do believe in general food and medicine companies in the US are less responsible than those in the UK; there are so many more recalls in the US for food due to quality control issues or contamination with disease, chemicals or other foreign substances-when such an incident happens in the UK it is national news right away because it is so rare. Many colourings, flavourings and other food additives widely used in the US are banned in the UK. Hydrogenated and trans fats are not banned here but they are extremely frowned upon and all the major supermarkets and food brands have removed them from their products. Corn syrup is in most products in the US but is rarely used in the UK and is even usually classed on packaging as an 'artificial sweetener'. Also it isn't advised for pregnant women in the UK to avoid deli meats (except uncooked varieties) because the ones available here are almost always prepackaged in a 'protective atmosphere' which isn't sterile but tends to be very highly controlled and thus there haven't been any incidences of listeria or salmonella from such products. So there are strong differences between the US and UK food industries and how they operate.

Some of the US formula brands do have stickers put onto versions sold or prescribed in the UK giving different directions than they advise in the US, such as using cooled boiled water and sterilising before making up formula, but others do not have this because perhaps the make-up of that formula means that any risks of making up with boiled water outweigh the benefits xx

 

[summer rain]

You can scare monger all you like about bacteria in water, bacteria in formula, etc., etc. It's a toxic world. What do you suppose breastfeeding mothers are eating and drinking and passing on? Differing levels of prescription drugs have been found in the municipal water supplies in major cities, mostly antidepressants. As well as metals and all sorts of things.

Nothing is 100% safe. Not formula. Not breastmilk. Not eating. Not breathing.

No-one is 'scaremongering' just explaining the reasons for the UK guidelines. While there are risks from everything, the UK government and UK formula companies do feel that such risks when FF can be minimised by taking certain hygiene and safety steps when preparing powdered formula, or by using ready made. Its not a breastmilk vs formula issue so that doesn't even need to come into it. But yes I personally do avoid drinking tap water when I can and instead drink spring water that is carefully checked and monitored for its content. Personally when I was formula feeding my sons I did use cooled boiled water and sterilise; with my eldest this was even before it was the official guideline. This is because I personally felt this was the safest option.

 

[andella95]

I honestly have no idea about the tap water safety issue other than what I've researched recently.

I think that the risk of a healthy, normal weight infant getting sick is just so incredibly low (1 out of millions), and that is why there is no official warning label on our formulas. As was already stated, there is risk in everything. It doesn't mean any of us are better mommies than the other. Just different.

 

[queenlavera]

Just wondering where you are getting this info that the US has sooo much recalls.
I found that both have recall sites and the list is long on the UK site as well as the US site.

https://www.fda.gov/Safety/Recalls/default.htm#Link_to_Food
https://www.food.gov.uk/enforcement/alerts/

Hydrogenated and trans fats are not used as much here either. Did you ever live in US? I wonder why you are so negative about my country.

 

[summer rain]

The list is long on the UK site but if you look at the dates there are a lot more food recalls in a shorter space of time there; than there are here. 40 in the last month in the US, 6 here. Also if you look at the recalls salmonella and listeria tend to be found in other than meat and fish products; such as fruit and vegetables, far more so than in the UK. In the UK these things tend to be found more in products that would be cooked/reheated and the organisms killed anyway but just as a precaution they are recalled. Recalls arising from actual poisoning due to contamination are very very rare here. It wasn't always this way but a number of serious food scares in the 80s forced the UK food industry to really clean up their act. I am not being 'negative about the US' but in such a large country with less stringent food standards/regulations than other countries (and this is a fact); and a requirement for more high intensity farming and production techniques, there are going to be food safety issues. Watch the film 'Food inc' and its pretty eye-opening. Yes I have visited your country and couldn't find any food that didn't contain either trans fats; artificial colouring, corn syrup or other undesirable additives, plus OH and I both have relatives living there, OH has spent many months in the US due to this-I visited a few years ago but recently visited a middle eastern country where the majority of food is big brand imports from the US-again a look at the ingredients showed things have not changed. Also I have many friends originally from the US who live in the UK and they say one thing they do not miss is the food and beverages in the USA. My main point is the reason for the guidelines in the UK are not due to poor water quality or problems with the production of the formula; but this is often cited as the reason for the differing guidelines over here, by US ladies; if anything the US is more in need of these safety guidelines than the UK. xx

 

[queenlavera]

Ok we will have to agree to disagree on this issue. To me I see it as a water issue, UK is following the WHO guidelines that cover many countries. So as I said before it may not be a water issue in the UK and some other countries but it definitely is in less developed ones. I also don't believe the US is just being negligent in not giving these instructions on our formula, as the bacteria/formula relationship does not seem to be as huge of an issue as it is being made. Lastly I wasn't trying to make you prove your opinion by listing all your US relations, I just wanted to know if you ever been, some people on here have a negative view of the US and never set a foot here. Just wanted to see if you are one of them, you are entitled to your opinion of my country as there are people that live here and talk bad about it. (Doesn't make sense to me, I would move to where I can be proud and happy)

 

[MustangGTgirl]

I used to boil water with my last baby and let it cool and that was with bottled water. With this baby I am not going to boil it, I don't think it is necessary. I will be buying him bottled water or using the water from my Pur filter but I would never ever feed him formula mixed with water right from the tap. Our tap water is chlorinated and smells like it has bleach in it and I couldn't imagine feeding it to a baby, I won't even drink it like that. I have a Pur filter on my tap that makes it taste delicious though

 

[MustangGTgirl]

You can scare monger all you like about bacteria in water, bacteria in formula, etc., etc. It's a toxic world. What do you suppose breastfeeding mothers are eating and drinking and passing on? Differing levels of prescription drugs have been found in the municipal water supplies in major cities, mostly antidepressants. As well as metals and all sorts of things.

Nothing is 100% safe. Not formula. Not breastmilk. Not eating. Not breathing.

No-one is 'scaremongering' just explaining the reasons for the UK guidelines. While there are risks from everything, the UK government and UK formula companies do feel that such risks when FF can be minimised by taking certain hygiene and safety steps when preparing powdered formula, or by using ready made. Its not a breastmilk vs formula issue so that doesn't even need to come into it. But yes I personally do avoid drinking tap water when I can and instead drink spring water that is carefully checked and monitored for its content. Personally when I was formula feeding my sons I did use cooled boiled water and sterilise; with my eldest this was even before it was the official guideline. This is because I personally felt this was the safest option.

I avoid tap water too and only drink bottled water but you do know that pretty much 99% of bottled water is really just tap water that has been purified? Even the ones that boast "spring water" and stuff like that is essentially purified tap water.

Still though, I would never drink water straight from the tap, it has to be purified for me to drink it.

 

[deafgal]

I think it has something do with the water treatment. In some part in Africa, don't they have to boil their water before drinking because of bacteria?

 

[deafgal]

I live in the city and our water company use UV to kill the bacteria. they use other methods in other parts of the city as well like chlorine. people have gotta sick from drink untreated water where I live.

 

[Duejan2012]

this thread has gotten very interesting. summer rain i didnt know that about the filters or bottled water there witch is why i wasasking differences in the first place

 

[Duejan2012]

Just wanted to add that all of this info is very interesting. I did ask my babies doctor about this issue and he said that he does advice most parents to start using tap water after the age of 6 months so that they get the floride in it. He said i made a big mistake with my dd by never giving her tap water therefore she never got floride.

 

[summer rain]

You can scare monger all you like about bacteria in water, bacteria in formula, etc., etc. It's a toxic world. What do you suppose breastfeeding mothers are eating and drinking and passing on? Differing levels of prescription drugs have been found in the municipal water supplies in major cities, mostly antidepressants. As well as metals and all sorts of things.

Nothing is 100% safe. Not formula. Not breastmilk. Not eating. Not breathing.

No-one is 'scaremongering' just explaining the reasons for the UK guidelines. While there are risks from everything, the UK government and UK formula companies do feel that such risks when FF can be minimised by taking certain hygiene and safety steps when preparing powdered formula, or by using ready made. Its not a breastmilk vs formula issue so that doesn't even need to come into it. But yes I personally do avoid drinking tap water when I can and instead drink spring water that is carefully checked and monitored for its content. Personally when I was formula feeding my sons I did use cooled boiled water and sterilise; with my eldest this was even before it was the official guideline. This is because I personally felt this was the safest option.

I avoid tap water too and only drink bottled water but you do know that pretty much 99% of bottled water is really just tap water that has been purified? Even the ones that boast "spring water" and stuff like that is essentially purified tap water.

Still though, I would never drink water straight from the tap, it has to be purified for me to drink it.

Not here it isn't, it is more like 1% that is purified tap water, just shows yet another difference between the US and UK. In the UK and Europe if it says spring water; legally it has to be spring water, there are very very strict laws regarding mis-selling of bottled water over here. All bottled water has to give clear information regarding its mineral composition and the exact location of the spring it has been taken from (including postcode). This government list has all the recognised brands and their sources (without postcode but these are on the bottles of the product)

https://www.defra.gov.uk/food-farm/food/standards/recognised-mineral-water/

There are a few brands that are purified tap water but these tend to be sold very cheap under value brands and clearly state on them that they are not from springs but purified tap water, often they are called 'table water'. A few years ago coke launched Dasani in the UK; while they didn't claim it was spring water, there was uproar when it was discovered by the media that it was treated tap water and this had not been clearly stated on the packaging-sales were affected immediately and after a bad batch of minerals was added to the product by accident, the water was soon withdrawn from the UK market never to be sold again, Coke's reputation took a massive hit as well.

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3809539.stm

Never mis-sell water to the French or the British....

 

[summer rain]

Just wanted to add that all of this info is very interesting. I did ask my babies doctor about this issue and he said that he does advice most parents to start using tap water after the age of 6 months so that they get the floride in it. He said i made a big mistake with my dd by never giving her tap water therefore she never got floride.

Fluoride is in most toothpastes and the amounts in these is plenty. Also I am not sure about in the US but in the UK there is some naturally occuring fluoride in most bottled mineral waters but it is not added to the water supply here except for in a few areas; such as Birmingham. A few areas have small amounts of fluoride naturally occuring in the tap water but it is only a few tiny areas. There are differences of opinion over fluoride, and its clear that too much of it can cause tooth discolouration and enamel damage. Some children are more susceptible to this than others, a girl in my class in school had moderate to severe fluorosis (damage caused by excessive fluoride exposure) but we lived in an area with no fluoride in the water, she had brushed her teeth after every meal with a small amount of toothpaste after suffering some decay as a baby but that didn't explain why she had such severe issues xx

 

[andella95]

You can scare monger all you like about bacteria in water, bacteria in formula, etc., etc. It's a toxic world. What do you suppose breastfeeding mothers are eating and drinking and passing on? Differing levels of prescription drugs have been found in the municipal water supplies in major cities, mostly antidepressants. As well as metals and all sorts of things.

Nothing is 100% safe. Not formula. Not breastmilk. Not eating. Not breathing.

No-one is 'scaremongering' just explaining the reasons for the UK guidelines. While there are risks from everything, the UK government and UK formula companies do feel that such risks when FF can be minimised by taking certain hygiene and safety steps when preparing powdered formula, or by using ready made. Its not a breastmilk vs formula issue so that doesn't even need to come into it. But yes I personally do avoid drinking tap water when I can and instead drink spring water that is carefully checked and monitored for its content. Personally when I was formula feeding my sons I did use cooled boiled water and sterilise; with my eldest this was even before it was the official guideline. This is because I personally felt this was the safest option.

I avoid tap water too and only drink bottled water but you do know that pretty much 99% of bottled water is really just tap water that has been purified? Even the ones that boast "spring water" and stuff like that is essentially purified tap water.

Still though, I would never drink water straight from the tap, it has to be purified for me to drink it.

Not here it isn't, it is more like 1% that is purified tap water, just shows yet another difference between the US and UK. In the UK and Europe if it says spring water; legally it has to be spring water, there are very very strict laws regarding mis-selling of bottled water over here. All bottled water has to give clear information regarding its mineral composition and the exact location of the spring it has been taken from (including postcode). There are a few brands that are purified tap water but these tend to be sold very cheap under value brands and clearly state on them that they are not from springs but purified water, often they are called 'table water'. A few years ago coke launched Dasani in the UK; while they didn't claim it was spring water, there was uproar when it was discovered by the media that it was treated tap water and this had not been clearly stated on the packaging-sales were affected immediately and after a bad batch of minerals was added to the product by accident, the water was soon withdrawn from the UK market never to be sold again, Coke's reputation took a massive hit as well.

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3809539.stm

Never mis-sell water to the French or the British....

https://www.fda.gov/food/foodsafety...ottledwatercarbonatedsoftdrinks/ucm077079.htm


To be labeled spring water in the US, it must meet guidelines as well.

 

[summer rain]

Thanks for that; I imagined it would be the case in the US also. However the big difference here is that most bottled water on sale is spring/mineral water, in the US from my understanding purified tap water has a bigger share of the market? Naturally occuring spring/mineral water here is very rich in minerals hence the general advice here not to use bottled water for babies, when boiled the minerals in such water can concentrate even more than they do normally xx

 

[andella95]

Hm...I'm not sure what the biggest source of bottled water is here. Seems like I usually see artesian water in bottles where I live. Seems like here are a lot of local brands as well and they state specifically where the water is from on the bottle.

I grew up on well water, and I miss it a lot actually. So much "tastier" than bottled or city water, lol.

 

[kanga]

Really enjoyed following this thread, it's quite interesting stuff and its also nice to see a mature friendly debate with facts

It may have got lost in the detail, but what was the answer to the original question again? UK - boil water due to following WHO guidelines and that we are cautious/water in pipes not sterile. US - don't boil because use bottled water?

Thanks

 

[andella95]

Really enjoyed following this thread, it's quite interesting stuff and its also nice to see a mature friendly debate with facts

It may have got lost in the detail, but what was the answer to the original question again? UK - boil water due to following WHO guidelines and that we are cautious/water in pipes not sterile. US - don't boil because use bottled water?

Thanks

US - don't boil because the risk so small + our formula isn't created to be mixed in anything other than cold/room temperature water. the contaminants we have in our water won't go away with boiling anyway, lol.

I personally use regular tap water & concentrate, which is sterile liquid formula in a can or quart bottle.

There is a lot of emphasis placed on handwashing & safe use of formula once it is prepared, however.

 

[vintage67]

It's still scaremongering, same old song and dance; scare, belitttle, statistics,
facts and links (which can be produced for anything), then stand back and bat eyelashes, "who me?" when called on it. I guess when a routine is "working" for you, why change it?