IVF Article number Bleh - Egg Collection

[Pippin]

Aww hon sorry you still feel down but just think you have 2 good emby's on board right now and you have a very good chance that they are going to grow into little babies, plus two that could be frozen. Please stay positive and get that amazing humour of yours to kick in and keep you positive.

 

[CurlySue]

Thanks, Pippin. I just feel like I have fallen from a great height, really. From a perfect response, a 12 egg collection to only TWO worth transferring? It's just scary.

The stupid thing is, I am a sucker, a masochist, a bit of a tw*t actually when it comes to stuff like this. I start looking things up that make no sense to me.

She said "these two stood out because the others were less even and more fragmented" - so, I start asking myself, does that mean the two inside of me are fragmented? I look it up and it says "fragmented embryos have little chance of implantation."

So now I am tearing my hair out. This was supposed to be a *happy* day. I'm sure I'll get over this but everywhere I look it seems to tell me "you lose, sucker!"

I suppose i can only move upwards from here. There are two possible babies in there. I'll take as good care of them as I can and hope for the best!

 

[MrsF]

thinking of you hun, big hugs x x x x

 

[Pippin]

Oh hon I can only guess at your worry but I do know how it feels to be constantly worried about my bean. Those first few weeks were agony and constant knicker checking and twinge worrying hasn't stopped for me even now. I still worry night and day, it's the not knowing at the start that really pissed me off and the fact there is nothing we can do about it. It's that nasty thing called 'Time' that can only help our stress. What horrid person invented that one huh!

Not sure what she means by 'fragmented' either as I have little first hand experience of IVF (my SIL and close friend went through it) but I feel your disappointment going from so high to only getting 2 (hopefully 4). I still have hope the other two will be good enough to freeze then you have piece of mind they are there if these two don't settle. Think positive though, I know it's hard, but have faith that these two will work.

What have you got planned to get you through the next two weeks? Some nice things I hope? No more googling I hope, it's a killer!!!!!

 

[Pippin]

Just read this:

Fragmentation in human embryos is quite common and many beautiful babies have resulted from implantation of embryos with fragments.

Hope that makes you feel better. x

Added edit: Please tell me if this isn't helping but also found this (figured I was allowed to google) and this to me sounds just like what you have described. 8 cells, slightly fragmented but they say it's classed as high quality at the same transfer day as you:

A slightly fragmented 8-cell embryo
Assisted hatching is being performed
The holding pipette is on the far left
A sperm is clearly visible at 7 o'clock (this sperm lost the race)
This embryo is high quality because it has an optimal cell number, the cells are fairly regular in size, and there is minimal fragmentation. Embryo grading: 8 cell, grade 3

 

[toby2]

(((((((((Sue))))))))) what a day for you, this whole thing is such a rollercoaster for you and with all the counting,measuring etc that is going on it must be so hard not to start measuring yourself-STEP AWAY FROM GOOGLE!!!
Two days ago all you wanted in the world was two good eggs on board and that is what you have, without even having to worry about asking!I am so like you and second guess everything the medical profession do but try not to read more in to what you have been told than what they have actually said
I really hope i am not comming across as patronizing, def not my intention and i have no experience of what you are going through but i just wish you and your eggs on board all the best in the world, rest up and go easy on yourself, you are doing an amazing thing-your eggs have done what they needed to for now-dont know if it is usful but friend had a very similar result to you-two 8cell eggs on board and two they may freeze on sat depending on what they do
xxxxx

 

[CurlySue]

Thanks girls. I know, this is all I wanted, the two embryos, but, to be honest, what I wanted was for them to say "We are only transferring one because it is as perfect an embryo as you can get and we are fully confident of it implanting" - wanted to have to ASK for two. Instead, I get her phoning and offering two, which set my mind ticking, thinking back to the info evening when they said "be grateful if they offer to transfer a single embryo because in this case they believe that one is better than two."

I don't know what it was. She just *seemed* negative. The way she phrased things, the way she said them, it wasn't like she was offering hope. It's like she was trying to downplay everything and take away any hope I had. Reminded me of teachers in school who know you are not going to get an A and try to soften the blow by saying "just do your best, it's okay if you fail."

I'm just kicking myself for getting my hopes up really. I always said all along that I wouldn't do that. I started being stupid and thinking up names. Imagining prams in my hallway. Trying to decorate the back room in my head. I should never have done that.

Ai hate being this negative and upset. My embryos might feel that. I wonder if they are still dividing in there. Won't be able to stop wondering...

If she hadn't fucking mentioned fragmentation I would be fine. But she did, so I feel rubbish, now. OH seems to think she said these embryos had "little to no fragmentation" but I recall differently. I recall her saying that the others were "more fragmented" ...

He's just in denial, I think. Sod.

 

[toby2]

Its so tough, i always have someone with me when i visit dr's etc for important stuff cause its almost impossible to hear what they actually say when its something so important to you-do you think you could ring and talk to someone in the morning so you can have the facts to deal with?mybe they can explain what they meant a bit futher?
You are not stupid to get your hopes up, hope is what keeps us going through all this stuff-as someone once said to me , not hoping or dreaming isnt going to make bad news easier to hear.
Do you know what ?I wish they had said you had grown the most perfect egg in the world to but you know what evasive *******s they are-they wouldnt tell you if you had the best looking egg in the world so they could cover their arses!!!
Am just going to keep telling you it till you are bored of hearing and beg me to stop-you are an amazing strong woman to get where you are and your eggs did what they needed too(((((()))))

 

[maz]

Hi CS

I know exactly how you're feeling right now. We went from 11 eggs down to two fairly good embryos on ET day during our first cycle, and from 14 eggs to 2 embryos on our second cycle.

At our private clinic, they graded the embryos from 1 to 4 - 1 being no fragmentation, 2 having up to 25% fragmentation, and 3 and 4 with more fragmentation and no real chance of implantation. It is very rare apparently to have grade 1 embryos - nearly all embryos have some slight fragmentation, and the clinic we went to said that the vast majority of their pregnancies come from grade 2 embryos. Our first cycle we had a grade 1 and a good grade 2 embryo. Second time we had two grade 2s.

Try not to worry - and I do realise that is easier said than done. I know what it's like. You try not to get too excited. You try not to get too far ahead of yourself. You try to keep your feet on the ground. But it is hard. All we long for is to get our positive result, our baby, our pushchair in the hall, and the carseat on the backseat. We made the mistake of naming our embryos first time round. We called them Alfie and Jasmine. When we got our we carried on calling them Alfie and/or Jasmine, and then we lost it/them. Second time round, I wasn't anywhere near as confident about the cycle. I think I knew from the day after EC that it wasn't going to work - intuition I think.

Maybe the nurse you were speaking to today is trying purposely not to get your hopes up. Perhaps that's what she's like with everyone she sees. Try and rest, stay as relaxed and calm as possible, and be nice to yourself. Do you have any relaxation CDs?

 

[CurlySue]

Hi Maz. Toby. Etc. Sorry for being a flaky bitch.

Its just such a let down isnt it? You go from one extreme to another. You think, "I did so well" and then you realise maybe not so well after all.

I don't know what the grades were. She didn't say. I wonder if she purposely didn't say because they were 3 or 4. Maybe the one that stuck for you was your Grade 1 embryo, Maz. You'll probably never know. But I, like you, have that 'feeling', that intuition. I feel, now, that it's not going to work. I've felt it wasn't going to work since years before I even start trying. I can imagine a child in my living room no more now than I could at fifteen. Shit, but true.

No relaxation CDs. Going to go to bed and watch Desperate Housewives or something. Anything to take my mind off this. I keep telling myself this is supposed to be a happy time but i just don't feel happy. I don't feel like there is anything inside of me at all.

 

[Lyns]

Jeez, hunny....Happy time? Its a bloody rollercoaster! I'm not in the slightest bit surprised you feel up and down.....it's crap you've ended up having to go through this, as opposed to the old 'boy meets girl and happily ever after crap', never mind anything else.

Please just try and get a good night's sleep...rest is only gonna help everything, huh? And remember the 'potential' you have on board

I really couldn't be sending you more luck if I tried! xxxxx

 

[Lilly123]

oh honey... try and focus on the positive, I know it must be hard. I also sometimes think my ICSI wont work and I havent even really started yet... but I think we are so used to all the let downs it is the way we protect ourselves... I definitely think you have a good chance... try and relax and look aftêr those little embies growing inside.. try some visualisation.... you should get a IVF relaxation CD.. it helps me


Good luck hun and Fx! I will be stalking u to see your and tell u , told u so

 

[Farie]

 

[maz]

Remember a few days ago I said try and hold on to the positivity you were feeling then ... because it's for this time now that you need it. This 2WW is far worse than any other for lots of reasons. Your body has more hormones than normal floating around it. As far as the experts can tell at this stage, you have two normally developing embryos in your uterus - which is the closest you've come to being pregnant. You want more than anything else, for a positive outcome at the end. But the thing that I found hardest to deal with, is the total lack of control. No matter what you do, what you eat, what you think, or what you say, you have no control over the end result.

The best thing you can do for yourself at this hellish time, is to keep your mind occupied. I won't tell you to relax, because you can't. But you can try and distract yourself for an hour or so everyday. Even if you just watch a pants film or a comedy programme - anything to distract you for an hour or so.

Good luck hun.

I am keeping my fingers crossed for you.

 

[CurlySue]

Thanks all, again. I do sometimes need to be shaken. I know you are all right and I know this should be a happy, momentous time but it's already Hellish. Maz, you were not wrong. I actually wish the positive attitude had stayed. It never stays long with self-doubting little me, though.

My OH's little brother Chris lost his dad this morning. Chris is seven. His dad was forty-one. Died in his sleep after a horrendous rapid-battle with cancer that left him blind and paralysed. He got married two days ago to his second wife. She's a widow, now, and Chris has lost his father.

Part of me feels that these two little embryos might be some kind of a silver lining for Chris and, if they grow, they can give him something to look forward to. I know that's probably unrealistic, and it might even be detrimental to my own mind, but at least it makes me feel positive. It makes me feel like something good could come, that little Xavi and Iniesta (as OH has now named them somewhat stupidly) might grow and form and actually make this little moment of doubt seem like a distant moment of stupidity.

Had a good cry this morning both for Chris' dad and for all of this. Sometimes a blowout is needed. Now I worry, I worry that 'they' know I am crying because in some way I am less than pleased with them, like I am becoming a pushy mother before the babies are even born or formed.

I'm going to try to stay positive only because today I was reminded just how hit and miss life can be. It's so hard, though, it really is.

 

[toby2]

hope your day has been ok-sad news about you oh brother and his dad
take care of yourself and dont worry about the crying, apparently its only long term stress that can effect them when they are inside you growing-i looked this up myself after a bad week!
chin up, one more day gone now-think your honesty must be a relief to others who have or will feel the same as you at this time
xxx

 

[CurlySue]

Thanks Toby. No real point in being in denial, is there? I feel a little better today. Better than yesterday, that is. I think that mini cry did me good, even if it wasn't anything to do with Xavi and Iniesta dancing around inside of me. Just felt good to 'release' that, so to speak.

The way I see it now, it's out of my hands. What will be will be. It'd be nice to think that I could do something to make it better but there's nothing. Can only wait and hope. Perhaps not hope TOO much, though...

 

[maz]

I'm sorry to hear about your OH's little brother and his dad ... that must be awful for you all. Poor wee boy. Glad to hear you're feeling a bit better than yesterday. Fingers crossed you'll have a celebration in a couple of weeks. When are you scheduled to test? Is it a blood test or the usual POAS test?

 

[CurlySue]

I'm sorry to hear about your OH's little brother and his dad ... that must be awful for you all. Poor wee boy. Glad to hear you're feeling a bit better than yesterday. Fingers crossed you'll have a celebration in a couple of weeks. When are you scheduled to test? Is it a blood test or the usual POAS test?

Tis horrible that he lost his dad so young. Was just so weird. The text we got from J's mum said "Michael passed away at 4am this morning peacefully in his sleep." She NEVER called him Michael. It was always Mike. Sounded strange hearing him called by his full name!

They told me to POAS a week on Wednesday and then phone them with the result. If it's good, they schedule follow up. Bad? The same. Follow up, with counselling if needed. Horrendous, though, aint it? You'd know, obviously. You've done this twice. I pity anyone who has to do this eight or nine times. Would not have the mental strength. Weedy, I am.

 

[CareBear]

Glad you're feeling a little better, sorry about OH's brother's dad