OBEM - upsetting content this week.

[Blah11]

oh for gods sake... step down off your soap box.

Uncalled for. Whether you like it or not Dizz is talking about how life has been since her child died. Very insensitive response. Sadly life is often very much like the way Dizz describes for many people who have a stillborn child.

dizz is being rude and uncalled for. she could put her point across without the name calling and aggression.

Maybe she is just fed up of people saying we can talk about anything else but let's not upset someone by talking about/ showing the aftermath of stillbirth on the TV as it might scare people. Whether she was rude or not, being told to get off your soapbox when you are talking about your child who has died is far beyond rude.

I agree with the last part but her posts are very agressive and abrupt.

 

[Blah11]

WOAHHHH i wasn't even talking to her!

cough*quotebutton!*cough

 

[Rhi_Rhi1]

Again can i just stress i wasn't talking to her !!!

 

[indy and lara]

oh for gods sake... step down off your soap box.

So which one of us is to get off our soap box and why?

 

[RainbowDrop_x]

oh for gods sake... step down off your soap box.

So which one of us is to get off our soap box and why?

I wondered that too

 

[smokey]

Yes - let's stigmatise miscarriage, stillbirth and pregnancy loss a little bit more just in case we upset someone with the reality of life. Let's continue to make it a taboo, to make it something to whisper about in hushed tones - let's continue to make those parents who lose feel more and more ashamed like they're nature's little dirty secret to be hidden away and not to acknowledge their lost children... because it might upset someone to mention that "look, this couple have had previous losses, this is very stressful for them and they're bloody terrified right now."

I mean gosh, how utterly inappropriate and inconsiderate of them for their babys to have died. How dare they and how dare Channel 4 choose to follow a couple who have this in their history and to acknowledge their previous lost children?!?!?

Do you realise just how nasty you sound and how utterly offensive you're coming across as to many on here who've had losses? Good on Channel 4 for NOT opting into the conspiracy of silence.

Sorry - babies die. It's reality. You can stack the odds as much as you can, you can hope, you can pray - but it happens.

But we where refering to a lose during filming not a previouse lose thats been talked about loads on the show.
No ones saying dont talk about it just that they woulndt broadcast a lose story from that birth that has been filmed specificaly for the show

 

[indy and lara]

But why not Smokey? If someone had agreed to be on the show and then sadly went on to have a child born sleeping they may well support showing their story. They may see it as a fitting memorial or to help raise awareness. They may or may not choose to show their baby but may choose to show the birth and the subsequent deafening silence in the room.

I just cannot see why this is such a taboo in the first place but especially not why it is so tabok in a show about pregnancy. 17 babies a day die at birth or just after so it is reality for a lot of people.

 

[KaceysMummy]

IMO that is very personal, I don't think it's something that should be broadcasted to the nation because it's so heartbreaking - i know its 'life' and it happens but there is plenty other things in life that people wouldn't watch happening first hand, and wouldn't be shown - reality or not.
I do totally agree that awareness should be raised about stillbirths, but not in the way of OBEM.
A documentary is totally different than watching a clip of a birth and watching a couple whole world be shattered, a documentary would offer a lot more support and information to people which OBEM would not. xx

 

[Arcanegirl]

If tempers are going to run high on this thread where misunderstanding can be very easy over text then maybe its best to step away from the thread?
I can see points from everyone, but along with the tempers they are not coming across very well.

 

[Eternal]

I am sure several people will have lost babies during the time of filming, but just because you may feel comfortable to share your experience of your still birth doesn't mean everyone is. i am comfortable discussing aspects of my miscarriage with others but there is no chance i would have wanted to be filmed at the time, and that was a 12 week miscarriage, there isn't a chance in hell i would publically share the loss of my baby with the world, not that there is anything wrong with those who do, but everyone i know personally who has suffered a loss at a last gestation wouldn't have wanted that.

So OBEM cant share still births without consent of the parents. On top of that they are regulated by OFCOM where they have to be careful to obey the rules:

Suffering and distress

8.16 Broadcasters should not take or broadcast footage or audio of people caught up in emergencies, victims of accidents or those suffering a personal tragedy, even in a public place, where that results in an infringement of privacy, unless it is warranted or the people concerned have given consent.
8.17 People in a state of distress should not be put under pressure to take part in a programme or provide interviews, unless it is warranted.
8.18 Broadcasters should take care not to reveal the identity of a person who has died or of victims of accidents or violent crimes, unless and until it is clear that the next of kin have been informed of the event or unless it is warranted.
8.19 Broadcasters should try to reduce the potential distress to victims and/or relatives when making or broadcasting programmes intended to examine past events that involve trauma to individuals (including crime) unless it is warranted to do otherwise. This applies to dramatic reconstructions and factual dramas, as well as factual programmes.

• In particular, so far as is reasonably practicable, surviving victims and/or the immediate families of those whose experience is to feature in a programme, should be informed of the plans for the programme and its intended broadcast, even if the events or material to be broadcast have been in the public domain in the past.

Even if given consent the people could turn around later and say they felt pressured and didn't want that shown.

So its not as easy as to say it should be shown and that its wrong that its not, because maybe people dont want that personal time shared with the world. I saw something on facebook showing a model of a 12 week fetus and My husband and I got upset thinking of our baby who died at 12 weeks, that is really personal to us and although I would happily give advice to people about my experience i don't want to see it around me when I am not prepared as it reminds me of that painful time and although my baby will never be forgotten i think if him differently now and don't want to keep reliving the miscarriage and specifically the pains I felt at that time.

I do wish people understood more about the loss of babies, i wish people had better understanding and empathy to those who have lost babies, but I am not sure what the best platform for that would be.

 

[blueskai]

Personally, I have to disagree with the thought that OBEM isn't an appropriate platform to deal with stillbirth. The fact it, it happens. Why shouldn't they be able to share their story, even if it is heartbreaking?
I know there are pregnant ladies who it may upset and worry, but to be honest that is a very very harsh reality that so many parents have had to deal with. I think it's so sad that people feel they should be "sheltered" from something like this just because it upsets them, when the poor parents who suffer this terrible loss have to face it head on for the rest of their lives.

To me, this is a birthing programme, stories about all types of births. Life is not all that rosy all of the time, and to me it would be unfair for them to portray it in that way, to sweep this terrible experience under the carpet for fear of pregnant ladies getting upset. To me, personally, it's quite a selfish way of thinking.

xo

 

[Eternal]

not sure if that was directed at me, but i am certainly not saying it shouldn't be shown and defiantly not saying pregnant ladies need protected, i am saying from someone who has lost a baby that i don't want to see it and my friend who suffered a still born and a neo natal death (she survived about 30 minutes) she wouldn't want to see it, at least for us, not yet. So I want awareness raised and perhaps it should happen, but I am just saying that it can cause hurt for those who are suffering or suffered from losses, which is different from someone worrying about their pregnancy, in fact those ladies would do well to know the risks and any symptoms for the cases that could have been avoided, i am def one for people standing up for themselves and not ignoring problems, i am lucky but medical professionals have ignored several things in all three of my childrens lives that could have killed them. So I am all for education.

I just am not ready to see a loss yet, and I am not sure how many people would be up for sharing that experience.

 

[Kelly81]

Personally I feel that whilst it may be factually based OBEM is made for entertainment rather than education and therefore showing an actual stillbirth might not be appropriate.

I have no issue with a couple talking about a previous stillbirth but can't help think that this will ramp up the tension of 'will everything be OK this time' for those of us sat at home watching who have no real experience of this situation, thus making entertainment out of their labour story.

I'm not saying stillbirths should never be shown on TV, of course they happen every day and people can always use more education into this sort of thing but a programme dedicated to the subject would ensure it was dealt with in a less light hearted way.

Don't mean to offend anyone who has suffered a loss, just my opinion

 

[KaceysMummy]

Yeah but there is a difference because your watching it happen.
There has been some birth stories about premature births and the baby sadly losing their fight for life - you don't watch the poor baby die, it simply comes up at the end in writing or is said - thats a harsh reality for a lot of people too but there is no way it would be shown like that. x

 

[blueskai]

So sorry for your loss, I've also suffered a loss myself hun, and it wasn't directed at you was just replying to the thread in general.

xo

 

[fidgets mammy]

I've read through all of this and tempers have definately frayed.

I have suffered a miscarraige almost 6yrs ago and I still find it hard to watch anything related to this.
Oven is an enertainment programme showing us life on a maternity ward, as much as certsin issues need to be made more aware obem is not the place. Not for the familys, crew, staff or people watching.

I dont think the poster of this thread meant for obe minute that anyone who has suffered a loss should hide away, she was kindly letting people know that this wks episode may be upsetting. I personally would be traumTised if I was watching and the baby died, as would many of other mothers and mothers to be. I agree it should be made more aware but in the right way, where people watching were informed of the upsetring nature rather than expecting a happy outcome. If a family on obem did want this shown then that is down to them and the producers not foe people on here to fight about.

What we have to remember is thar there arw many of familys out there who woyld not cope with such a thing. And I'm sure channel 4 have researched this.

 

[blueskai]

I'm not the one telling mothers to be ashamed of their little ones, to hide away so they don't upset people and trying to make pregnancy loss back into some dirty little secret.

No I'm not being over the top - I'm just determined to fight the people who'd like to make pregnancy loss back into some dirty little taboo because it "upsets" them. It's no different to the ones who sit in third tri complaining about "unreasonable cows who have miscarriages meaning I can't rabbit on about my pregnancy all day every day" - despite the fact that when you read the post, the poor woman in question's done or said nowt apart from doing their job! Yet the very existence of these women is begrudged as some form of peeing on everyone's pregnancy party.

Think it's only fair for OBEM to accept and focus on the fact that sad things CAN and DO happen and those sad things DO massively, massively colour the emotional experience of any subsequent pregnancy... which is all they're doing - YOU were the one who started ranting as if they're showing an actual stillbirth and dragging it all out of context. Pregnancy after any loss is an utter different kettle of fish - I can quote statistics and probabilities tilll the cows come home - because the only way I've stayed remotely calm is to have that mental tick list of possible bad things and cross off each potential hurdle as we've jumped it - an utterly utterly different way of handling worry to many women who have the luxury of wrapping themselves up in some kind of glorious bubble of innocence - that innocence was long since stolen from many of us.

For something like OBEM which tries to do the whole emotional journey thing - you want to obliterate a part of that couple's emotional journey in dealing with the past demons because it might upset your evening's fluffy entertainment... you want to only see the positive births? Shall we have some kind of "rate my birth" screening criteria so we don't upset... what about that upsetting people who DON'T get those births - or do they not count?

I wish there WAS more coverage of miscarriage and stillbirth in the media - done properly and not in the usual soapoperaesque - fall down stairs > dramatic bleeding > baby's gone > back in pub next day crap way it's done. I'd LIKE some acceptance of the utter emotional devastation it can cause, I'd LIKE to live in the world where these hidden bereavements are accepted as true and devastating losses - instead of being made to feel like some kind of inconvenience in the way of pregnantzillas getting upset by mine and my children's existence.

Sorry my life doesn't fit into your Disney-esque world view. Actually, no I'm not - I don't resent, begrudge or feel shame in my lost children's existence (I personally don't "do" the term angel babies)... THEY deserve better than me feeling shame for them. I will always be proud that me and their father got to know them however fleetingly.

really agree with every single thing you've said, could not have said it better myself. I'm so sorry for your loss hun
xo

 

[Tasha]

Blah there are many people who dont know that stillbirths happen. I did know about baby loss but I certainly didnt realise that I could lose Honey one day from my planned induction.

I personally would never be filmed for oBEM but if in some parrell universe I was being and I had my third stillbirth, then without a shadow of a doubt I would want it shown. My births were beautiful, my babies were beautiful and the time after them being born was as close to perfect as it could possibly be. It would be sad for other people, but it would get the message to a much wider audience than a documentry.

I had stupid comments after Honey like when I texted my friend to let her know her name, she replied omg what has happened now, you still named it? Or another great response when talking about my contractions to another person, she said you still had contractions? I replied yes how else would I give birth and she answered omg you still had to give birth?

I do believe a warning at the beginning of the programme would be right, but handled sensitivly then I see no reason for a labour with a baby born sleeping not to be shown by OBEM.

Any way this isnt about about a baby born sleeping, but about the stresses and strains of PAL and the birth of a Rainbow

 

[Blah11]

Blah there are many people who dont know that stillbirths happen. I did know about baby loss but I certainly didnt realise that I could lose Honey one day from my planned induction.

I personally would never be filmed for oBEM but if in some parrell universe I was being and I had my third stillbirth, then without a shadow of a doubt I would want it shown. My births were beautiful, my babies were beautiful and the time after them being born was as close to perfect as it could possibly be. It would be sad for other people, but it would get the message to a much wider audience than a documentry.

I had stupid comments after Honey like when I texted my friend to let her know her name, she replied omg what has happened now, you still named it? Or another great response when talking about my contractions to another person, she said you still had contractions? I replied yes how else would I give birth and she answered omg you still had to give birth?

I do believe a warning at the beginning of the programme would be right, but handled sensitivly then I see no reason for a labour with a baby born sleeping not to be shown by OBEM.

Any way this isnt about about a baby born sleeping, but about the stresses and strains of PAL and the birth of a Rainbow

omfg who need enemies with friends like that!

 

[indy and lara]

But that is reality in the real world outside forums Blah.
- The mw who told me that she cuddles people because she is a mummy and maybe one day I would understand.
- The friend who would not see me because it might be catching..
- The people who will not call our son by his name as it is not conventional.
- Numerous people who tell me that I have only had one child.
- the people who don't believe I gave birth to him. Dont know how they think he was born.

It goes on and on and on. There is probably not one person who has lost a child who doesn't have at least one example like this.