Rant - Feeling so hopeless about sleep!

[VikkiD]

Why do men not understand that a baby gets overtired?
I am p'd off today after another night of no sleep!
OH didnt go the gym last night so we went to the park u stupidly forgot my phone and lost track of time so by the time we got home it was 6:50 by the time lo was in bed it was 7:20 and it took him ages go sleep as I think he was overtired everytime I say this to OH he just thinks I am mad an the more tired lo is the longer he will sleep. Well guess who's been up every hour last night yes me not him I am so mad at him today an he's still sleeping now so tonight I will be shoving him out the door to the gym so I can put lo to bed in peace.
Sorry for the rant. Xx

 

[stephie_corin]

Oh no! I hope Daniel's sleep is better tonight. You poor thing!!! It's funny isn't it - I would assume (before i had a baby) that a really tired baby would sleep, well... like a baby! But they just don't. I hope OH realises now how important bed time is! X

 

[Shadowy Lady]

hi guys! I haven't posted here forever but just wanted to say hang in there!! We had a few up and down weeks at 6 months but since 6 months 3 weeks we have had sttn pretty much 98% of the time. There was a time I was so desperate (around 5 months I think) I thought I would never sleep again and my anxiety was killing me. I was also on sleep meds and having a fear of medication was making things worse for me.

I stopped taking sleep meds (though I was on a very low dose, 0.25mg) all together 2 weeks ago as it seems that Sofia is now very consistent with sleeping. After a rough week of meds withdrawal and fear of not sleeping, I'm back to sttn myself lmao

Just wanted to say there's light at the end of the tunnel. This thread and the sweet ladies posting in it helped me a lot during my sleepless time and I wanted to give back

 

[gaiagirl]

Thanks Shadowy! I dont think we will have sttn here for a long time, but things have settled down since 4/5 months even despite the major teeth movement. So all I can hope for is that naps lengthen, evenings improve a bit over time and he continues to have very quick night wakings

I could live with all of that for quite awhile!

 

[stephie_corin]

Thanks Shadowy. I'm so glad things are going well with you! I'm with you Gaia, I think sleeping through the night is a long way off for us. I'll be happy if I can soothe him easier at night (not picking him up, I'm hoping a cuddle or lying down nursing will eventually soothe him).

Today when he woke after his first nap (40 mins) I didn't help him back to sleep but I did for his second nap (1 hour 15)... It only took 30 minutes to get him down tonight and he has been asleep ever since ! (2.5 hours!!) I don't know if its progress or just coincidence and he isn't teething tonight.

Anyway, wishing you all a really good night. X

 

[stephie_corin]

So last night was very weird. He slept three hours straight, waking just before 10pm. He took an hour to settle and then slept 11-1am and was then awake until 330. I could not get him to sleep. He was quite happy to sit up and look around but cried the minute I tried to rock, nurse or soothe him back to sleep. Then he woke again at 4 and 5 and then up at 6am. He was quite grumpy this morning and its now almost 9 am and he is still not asleep for his first nap.

I think this might be a developmental thing as he's just learnt to go from lying on his tummy to a sitting position. Although when I said this to DH this morning he said that I've been saying this for months (and teething is our other favourite excuse).

I had a bad mummy moment last night. I was just so frustrated and tired and spoke sharply to Cully.

I have two questions:
1) to those who bed share, how do you dress LO? Part of the night he is in his cot attached to the bed and part he is in my arms. He's in a sleeping bag (1 tog) and a long sleeved sleep suit. Obviously in my arms is a lot warmer.
2) what is your upper limit for giving pain relief (for example, you'll only give it three consecutive nights). I'm thinking of setting a benchmark of 2 nights maximum per week (and obviously only if he is crying in pain) and the rest of the week just put up with bad sleep. I'm slightly concerned about the toxic effect of using pain relief over a prolonged period.

Many thanks as always xxx

 

[Aimee4311]

Sorry it was such a hard night, Stephie!

I only have Josalyn in a short sleeved onesie and we both stay plenty warm!

I don't have an answer about the pain medicine as I've not given any to Josalyn yet.

 

[Boo44]

Hi girls long time no post!

Jack has started sitting up in his sleep! He did it twice last night. He can't get down so has to be laid down by us but then immediately sleeps again. It's so strange! Have any of you got advice re that?

Also as he's now at 3 different child cares during the week I have lost control of his naps He still needs 2 as his morning wake up is tending to be around 6.30 so by 10am he's tired. Thing is they often report that he had like 2 45min naps. At home he would have much longer naps. And he's often overtired which I think is contributing to early wake ups. I don't think there is much I can do about this? If he would have one nap days I think they would find it easier but I can't see him getting to lunch time! Any advice girls?

Also he's getting 2 pre molars now and has started pulling to standing and cruising so its all going on!!

Hope you're all well xx

 

[VikkiD]

I put lo to bed earlier last night he was asleep at 6;45 we did have a wake up at 12.15 for about 20 mins and he woke again at 5:30 but was still tired so I lay him back down after a little cuddle and he then woke after 7am so much better

 

[Noelle610]

Hi girls long time no post!

Jack has started sitting up in his sleep! He did it twice last night. He can't get down so has to be laid down by us but then immediately sleeps again. It's so strange! Have any of you got advice re that?

Also as he's now at 3 different child cares during the week I have lost control of his naps He still needs 2 as his morning wake up is tending to be around 6.30 so by 10am he's tired. Thing is they often report that he had like 2 45min naps. At home he would have much longer naps. And he's often overtired which I think is contributing to early wake ups. I don't think there is much I can do about this? If he would have one nap days I think they would find it easier but I can't see him getting to lunch time! Any advice girls?

Also he's getting 2 pre molars now and has started pulling to standing and cruising so its all going on!!

Hope you're all well xx

Hey hun! Unfortunately my advice on both front is "wait it out".

With the sitting up, he'll figure that out. If you're comfortable letting him fuss a bit, you can let him figure out how to lay down. Can it do it during the daytime? If not, it might be good to work with him on it.

With the naps, I think they'll lengthen as he gets used to the new routine. This is pretty common when babies go through a schedule change. Does he have a comfort object that you could send with him to his care givers? That may help.

 

[mellyboo]

Well I haven't wanted to post in here seems like every time I do I get the BNB curse and she does worse again.. But lately were only up 1-2 time's a night.. I should add that the 2nd time some time's is only at 7am but if i treat it like a " Night time" waking she goes back to bed till 830 LOL!!... so i shouldn't really count it but I do.. ahahah!!

 

[Boo44]

Thanks noelle! He's a funny creature in that when he's on his back during the day, he acts like he's stuck! Even though I know he is capable of rolling if he wanted. So it works good for nappy changes etc. but it means he never wants to be on his back when he's awake so I'd have a hard time teaching him to learn to lie from sitting!

Funny thing is he has always slept on his back all night long. Occasionally on his side now. So the 'inability' to roll works fine there as well

What I want to know is how he gets to sitting up in the night! He must roll onto his tummy, because he is always on his tummy and crawling around etc and sitting. I've just never ever seen him get to his tummy from his back. Wish I had a video monitor lol

Is Charlie still on 2 naps? Think I'll just wait it out like you say, and let his 2 naps (hopefully) get gradually longer as he settles down. It's only been 2 wks so far. He has a 'bun-bun' comforter and two dummies (one in mouth one in hand!) so he's fine there xx

 

[mellyboo]

Thanks noelle! He's a funny creature in that when he's on his back during the day, he acts like he's stuck! Even though I know he is capable of rolling if he wanted. So it works good for nappy changes etc. but it means he never wants to be on his back when he's awake so I'd have a hard time teaching him to learn to lie from sitting!

Funny thing is he has always slept on his back all night long. Occasionally on his side now. So the 'inability' to roll works fine there as well

What I want to know is how he gets to sitting up in the night! He must roll onto his tummy, because he is always on his tummy and crawling around etc and sitting. I've just never ever seen him get to his tummy from his back. Wish I had a video monitor lol

Is Charlie still on 2 naps? Think I'll just wait it out like you say, and let his 2 naps (hopefully) get gradually longer as he settles down. It's only been 2 wks so far. He has a 'bun-bun' comforter and two dummies (one in mouth one in hand!) so he's fine there xx

I could see Jordyn doing this augh..
when she first started rolling on her stomach in her sleep she would realize and whine because she was so tired she didn't no what to do and made me paranoid she couldn't roll over ( which she can) just doesn't want to because when shes on the floor here she rolls!

 

[AmyS]

I think I've read every page of this thread over the last few days! It's fascinating!!!

I've been bugging Noelle with pm's for the past few days, so I thought I'd give her a small break and get some tips from other ladies going through the "fun" stuff right now!

LO is going to be 7 months in a week. I've always fed her to sleep for night time and naps, so she's never been left to self soothe. However, at daycare, they do let her CIO.

She used to STTN, but then, you know, all that crappy developmental stuff started happening, and now she has mostly really bad nights. We've got multiple wake ups, 4:30 wake ups (for the day she thinks), eyes popping right back open as soon as I lay her down...the normal...

I was going to do some sleep training. I was going to do the sleep lady shuffle. I even thought about Ferber. I REALLY thought about Ferber yesterday morning when I had only had an hour of sleep the night before. But, when night time comes, I chicken out. Or, I think, maybe she'll grow out of this. Maybe tonight will be better.

Last night was better - only up 3 times. I was still up at 4:30am for the day, rocking her in the chair because I don't want her up that early for the day!!! If I try to put her back down that early in the morning, she just wakes right back up. Urgh.

Right now, I've been feeding her to sleep (with usually one bottle during the night). When she wakes up, I pick her up and rock her for a few minutes then lay her back down. She's usually back to sleep before I even move away from the crib. So, I really would like some tips for self soothing in the crib. But this is what happens when I try patting her on her back in the crib (she's a tummy sleeper): she starts trying to roll around like a maniac! Do I just let her go and pat whatever lands under my hand, or do I hold her down?? Or, is there a better way to soothe in the crib??

I know, I really need to work on teaching her how to self soothe on her own. I think she probably has an idea, since daycare has been making her CIO for about 4 weeks now for naps. But she knows she has mommy wrapped around her little finger!!!

Thanks for any suggestions!

 

[Noelle610]

Amy hope you get some good suggestions!

Those babies are tricky, aren't they Boo?! He must roll onto his tummy and then sit up. He is likely "practicing" this new skill in his sleep and it will get old soon

Charlie is still on two naps most days. Usually like 9-10 and then 1-3 or some variation of that. She does have one nap days. I think she needs two, but all of the other babies at her daycare are on one, so I've told our provider it's fine for her to skil the morning nap if they go to the park or something. I'm trying to be flexible - LOL! When it works out, it's fine. Yesterday she only napped from 12:30-3 and that was great. But if it doesn't work out and the one nap is short it sucks and results in an overtired baby.

 

[mellyboo]

Amy hope you get some good suggestions!

Those babies are tricky, aren't they Boo?! He must roll onto his tummy and then sit up. He is likely "practicing" this new skill in his sleep and it will get old soon

Charlie is still on two naps most days. Usually like 9-10 and then 1-3 or some variation of that. She does have one nap days. I think she needs two, but all of the other babies at her daycare are on one, so I've told our provider it's fine for her to skil the morning nap if they go to the park or something. I'm trying to be flexible - LOL! When it works out, it's fine. Yesterday she only napped from 12:30-3 and that was great. But if it doesn't work out and the one nap is short it sucks and results in an overtired baby.

This is my worse fear going back to work and she won't be able to go down with out being in her crib .. I'm finding latly she's having a hard time napping anywhere but.. that or the car.

Her morning nap is fine were always home in the morning ....the afternoon one she always falls alseep in the car ( on the weekends) or if OH is around during the day and were out we will just drive around till she wakes up..

Lets say i'm at the mall around her afternoon nap there is no way little miss jordyn will be sleeping she's to busy seeing whats going on instead!!

I have a feeling her days in day care for awhile are going to be harsh one's. lol

 

[stephie_corin]

I think I've read every page of this thread over the last few days! It's fascinating!!!

I've been bugging Noelle with pm's for the past few days, so I thought I'd give her a small break and get some tips from other ladies going through the "fun" stuff right now!

LO is going to be 7 months in a week. I've always fed her to sleep for night time and naps, so she's never been left to self soothe. However, at daycare, they do let her CIO.

She used to STTN, but then, you know, all that crappy developmental stuff started happening, and now she has mostly really bad nights. We've got multiple wake ups, 4:30 wake ups (for the day she thinks), eyes popping right back open as soon as I lay her down...the normal...

I was going to do some sleep training. I was going to do the sleep lady shuffle. I even thought about Ferber. I REALLY thought about Ferber yesterday morning when I had only had an hour of sleep the night before. But, when night time comes, I chicken out. Or, I think, maybe she'll grow out of this. Maybe tonight will be better.

Last night was better - only up 3 times. I was still up at 4:30am for the day, rocking her in the chair because I don't want her up that early for the day!!! If I try to put her back down that early in the morning, she just wakes right back up. Urgh.

Right now, I've been feeding her to sleep (with usually one bottle during the night). When she wakes up, I pick her up and rock her for a few minutes then lay her back down. She's usually back to sleep before I even move away from the crib. So, I really would like some tips for self soothing in the crib. But this is what happens when I try patting her on her back in the crib (she's a tummy sleeper): she starts trying to roll around like a maniac! Do I just let her go and pat whatever lands under my hand, or do I hold her down?? Or, is there a better way to soothe in the crib??

I know, I really need to work on teaching her how to self soothe on her own. I think she probably has an idea, since daycare has been making her CIO for about 4 weeks now for naps. But she knows she has mommy wrapped around her little finger!!!

Thanks for any suggestions!

Hi Amy and welcome!! You know I followed your other thread. Our babies are so similar!! Culver was STTN at three months (12 hours straight) and I thought I had this parenting thing nailed!!! Then, hello four month sleep regression!!

I am a walking zombie. A good night is 4 or 5 wakeups. A bad night might be 20! It sounds like you are in the same place as us - and you work!!! So I take my hat off to you.

I personally think our current sleep issues relate to hitting milestones and teething - and just being a highly strung, very interested in the world baby.

I've definitely had moments where I've thought 'maybe CIO is the only answer?' But I'm not prepared to do it. If you do decide to do it, I would be behind you 100 percent but its not right for my family.

If you don't decide to so CIO I wonder if you would consider bed sharing. On our good nights, this has made a world of difference. It's much easier to soothe Cully and I can nurse lying down. I've side carred the cot to the bed and put our mattress on the ground. Your LO may also be missing mummy as you are at work, so this might help her to feel like she has more mummy time.

Regarding soothing, with my current set up I can lie next to Cully and rub his tummy. Some nights this works well but if he is teething this doesn't work at all. It's a real back saver though, being able to actually lie next to LO.

Regarding early wakeups, we had this quite badly too but the last week he has consistently woken between 545-615. What I did was consistently rock him back to sleep, even if it took an hour of me rocking. Now I have to soothe him at 5 but he goes back to sleep very easily.

I have my own idea about putting baby to bed asleep. I don't think it's as bad as is sometimes made out and I think it takes some babies (like mine) a while to learn how to do it. Until he is older and I can reason with him, I'm happy to help him to sleep. I've spoken to a few mums and anecdotally the ability to fall asleep by themselves or whether they have to be put down asleep by mum doesn't seem to have a massive correlation to night sleep. I'm sure others will have a different experience though.

Please keep posting, this is a great thread and all the women are so supportive. We all do things differently and have different approaches to sleep but it makes it a really balanced thread. Everyone also respects these differences and to be honest I haven't 'met' a nicer group of women.

Good luck!!! I'm sure you'll get some excellent advice from the others, I just wanted to share my perspective. X

Ps despite my rant I have seen huge improvements. These ladies have helped me get a good day schedule and also advised on a whole host of night issues. Thing will get better for you!!

 

[stephie_corin]

Vikki and Melly, glad you had great nights and things are getting better xx

 

[AmyS]

stephie - Thanks for the reply! It does sound like we've got a lot in common! Unfortunately, DH isn't comfortable co-sleeping since he moves around so much, and we have 2 dogs that sleep with us. Currently, LO is in her crib, and I sleep on an air mattress on her floor.

From what I've read, I agree with you that how they are put to sleep doesn't have much to do with how they sleep through the night. Many pages back on this thread, there was a gal (Jessica, I think?) who fed her baby to sleep, and she ended up sleeping through the night. I didn't read word-for-word, but I'm pretty sure she didn't change what she was doing.

I also need to get my Chloe on a good day schedule, but it's so hard with daycare. I don't blame them, since it's 4 babies to 1 provider, it's really hard to follow a specific schedule. Chloe will be home with us for 4 days this weekend, so I might try getting her naps straightened out. Right now, she is tired 2 hours after wake time, I might try to stretch that out a little and see if I can get her some longer naps. Thirty minute naps does not help the situation!

 

[seaweed eater]

Vikki, glad you had a better morning! I can totally sympathize with your previous post. DH always wants to suggest various changes to naps during the day to work around our schedule, and I just tell him that he's not the one who has to deal with the fallout at night! Which is true!!

Boo, I'm sorry I don't know what to suggest about the sitting up what Noelle said is the advice I've generally heard, that it doesn't really matter whether you keep setting him down or letting him fuss, either way you just have to wait until he learns. Regarding daycare, I agree with Noelle again...it takes them a little while to adjust to a new daily routine. I've seen it with Munchkin and with other babies at his daycare. How long has he been going to these different childcares?

Stephie, hugs!! That sounds just like a few nights we've had over the past few weeks. It's so frustrating, because I feel like the one rule I've always tried to stick to is that nighttime is NOT for playing. But that's the only thing that prevents screaming. I'm 99% sure it's mostly developmental so we're just trying to WIO at the moment, but it doesn't happen every night -- if it did, I think I'd be a little more aggressive. Hang in there!

Shadowy, so glad you are STTN now yourself!! That must feel amazing!

Amy, welcome will get to your post separately...