This morning

[Larkspur]

There are tiny newborns at my LO swimming classes......

A few weeks old? Every swimming class I investigated did not take babies till 3 months ie after their first two immunizations because of the risk of illness.

Waterbabies - I'm not making it up....

Must be different where I live. Still I stand by my belief that what he writes is pretty wildly exaggerated. There are loads of things that didn't sound right to me in his stories but I have no interest in going through them one by one.

 

[LoraLoo]

There are tiny newborns at my LO swimming classes......

A few weeks old? Every swimming class I investigated did not take babies till 3 months ie after their first two immunizations because of the risk of illness.

Waterbabies - I'm not making it up....

Must be different where I live. Still I stand by my belief that what he writes is pretty wildly exaggerated. There are loads of things that didn't sound right to me in his stories but I have no interest in going through them one by one.

If you are taking everything with a pinch of salt then maybe you should take it as a pinch of salt that the baby cried for 3 hours.....

 

[Larkspur]

There are tiny newborns at my LO swimming classes......

A few weeks old? Every swimming class I investigated did not take babies till 3 months ie after their first two immunizations because of the risk of illness.

Waterbabies - I'm not making it up....

Must be different where I live. Still I stand by my belief that what he writes is pretty wildly exaggerated. There are loads of things that didn't sound right to me in his stories but I have no interest in going through them one by one.

If you are taking everything with a pinch of salt then maybe you should take it as a pinch of salt that the baby cried for 3 hours.....

Yes... That's sort of my point. I think the whole story is probably exaggerated for effect, so I am personally done discussing it because I don't think it's reliable.

 

[jenkins]

I missed this morning but I read the article earlier on today after seeing it on Facebook.

On here I never comment on controversial topics like CIO etc but this was awful to read. I feel desperately sorry for the little boy.

If that makes me judgemental then I'm fine with that. I personally feel like (and only going from what I've read - because of course I don't know them) they could have done more to deal with the reasons/issues why the toddler was getting up at night.

If I had exhausted all options and it still wasn't resolved then I would have just brought him into my bed/room and put a bolt on MY door so
we were all locked in together. Problem solved.

Now if that wasn't an acceptable solution to them, then that is really sad to me that in order to keep their toddler safe they resorted to leaving him to cry hysterically, behind a locked door, alone, for 3 hours. He comforted his wife outside the door, what comfort did his son get??

I agree they should have persevered with other methods first. Looks like they already tried having him in bed.

"But it’s at this time that the first cracks appear. Straight away, a literal barrier is placed between you when you have your baby sleeping in your bed.

Sonny did this for the first few months of his life. Every night I was terrified of rolling onto him and crushing him to death, so would build a pillow mountain
to stop myself from moving."

Although we do still bed share I completely understand that wouldn't be right fir everyone

If I could fit it in I'd bring his whole bed in or get an extra bed/mattress and sleep in his room with him. Tbh I'd even sleep on the landing outside his room so I'd hopefully wake when he went walkabouts.

Just more things I've thought of since I posted lol

 

[LoraLoo]

There are tiny newborns at my LO swimming classes......

A few weeks old? Every swimming class I investigated did not take babies till 3 months ie after their first two immunizations because of the risk of illness.

Waterbabies - I'm not making it up....

Must be different where I live. Still I stand by my belief that what he writes is pretty wildly exaggerated. There are loads of things that didn't sound right to me in his stories but I have no interest in going through them one by one.

If you are taking everything with a pinch of salt then maybe you should take it as a pinch of salt that the baby cried for 3 hours.....

Yes... That's sort of my point. I think the whole story is probably exaggerated for effect, so I am personally done discussing it because I don't think it's reliable.

Fair enough

 

[Irish Eyes]

Firstly, when my husband married me, it was for the good & bad times. If he dared to threaten to walk out on me if I didn't do things his way then I would be reconsidering whether or not he should be my husband.

Secondly, the phrase I hate the most is "he was fed, watered, dry & warm... what more could he possibly want?!" It seriously sounds like people are talking about animals with this. How about he wants cuddles, reassurance etc?! I understand there are children with sleep issues. I honestly don't believe that every child can just fall into line of sleeping 7-7. I've never slept 7-7, even as a child & my mum has always said it was just something she had to learn to accept. She actually felt guilty that she would sometimes put the TV on in her room for me to watch while she caught up with a bit of sleep, but I was in her bed.

Why do we insist that every child has to fit into the norm of sleeping 7-7?! If they don't then they need to be "trained". That poor, poor child.

 

[LoraLoo]

I missed this morning but I read the article earlier on today after seeing it on Facebook.

On here I never comment on controversial topics like CIO etc but this was awful to read. I feel desperately sorry for the little boy.

If that makes me judgemental then I'm fine with that. I personally feel like (and only going from what I've read - because of course I don't know them) they could have done more to deal with the reasons/issues why the toddler was getting up at night.

If I had exhausted all options and it still wasn't resolved then I would have just brought him into my bed/room and put a bolt on MY door so
we were all locked in together. Problem solved.

Now if that wasn't an acceptable solution to them, then that is really sad to me that in order to keep their toddler safe they resorted to leaving him to cry hysterically, behind a locked door, alone, for 3 hours. He comforted his wife outside the door, what comfort did his son get??

I agree they should have persevered with other methods first. Looks like they already tried having him in bed.

"But it’s at this time that the first cracks appear. Straight away, a literal barrier is placed between you when you have your baby sleeping in your bed.

Sonny did this for the first few months of his life. Every night I was terrified of rolling onto him and crushing him to death, so would build a pillow mountain
to stop myself from moving."

Although we do still bed share I completely understand that wouldn't be right fir everyone

If I could fit it in I'd bring his whole bed in or get an extra bed/mattress and sleep in his room with him. Tbh I'd even sleep on the landing outside his room so I'd hopefully wake when he went walkabouts.

Just more things I've thought of since I posted lol

We co-slept with last LO (our youngest just would never, and still wont, settle in ebd with us) til she was 20 months, but when she went in her own room/bed i drew a line and now i just hate sharing my bed. She clambered in last night and I've woke this morning aching all over and with a stiff, painful neck! I couldn't go back to it now. Maybe they felt the same.

Everyone seems to be blaming the Dad, yes it was him that gave the ultimatum but there mother had ample opportunity to explore other avenues- like you say, sleep outside his room etc. Its not all down to the Dad x

 

[LoraLoo]

Firstly, when my husband married me, it was for the good & bad times. If he dared to threaten to walk out on me if I didn't do things his way then I would be reconsidering whether or not he should be my husband.

Secondly, the phrase I hate the most is "he was fed, watered, dry & warm... what more could he possibly want?!" It seriously sounds like people are talking about animals with this. How about he wants cuddles, reassurance etc?! I understand there are children with sleep issues. I honestly don't believe that every child can just fall into line of sleeping 7-7. I've never slept 7-7, even as a child & my mum has always said it was just something she had to learn to accept. She actually felt guilty that she would sometimes put the TV on in her room for me to watch while she caught up with a bit of sleep, but I was in her bed.

Why do we insist that every child has to fit into the norm of sleeping 7-7?! If they don't then they need to be "trained". That poor, poor child.

Children that age generally need around 12 hours of sleep. Maybe 7pm was when he needed to go to bed. He was happy to play in his room if he woke before 7am. I dont see a problem here?

 

[lau86]

Something about him seems a bit strange, I don't like him. Personally I couldn't leave my son crying behind a locked door and I don't think it's right but if they say the child is happier who am I to argue

 

[LoraLoo]

Something about him seems a bit strange, I don't like him. Personally I couldn't leave my son crying behind a locked door and I don't think it's right but if they say the child is happier who am I to argue

I wouldn't do it either but its worked for them so in my eyes thats a success He was probably crying for 3 hours if he was in and out of bed 37 times a night and being put back, told off etc.

 

[Irish Eyes]

Firstly, when my husband married me, it was for the good & bad times. If he dared to threaten to walk out on me if I didn't do things his way then I would be reconsidering whether or not he should be my husband.

Secondly, the phrase I hate the most is "he was fed, watered, dry & warm... what more could he possibly want?!" It seriously sounds like people are talking about animals with this. How about he wants cuddles, reassurance etc?! I understand there are children with sleep issues. I honestly don't believe that every child can just fall into line of sleeping 7-7. I've never slept 7-7, even as a child & my mum has always said it was just something she had to learn to accept. She actually felt guilty that she would sometimes put the TV on in her room for me to watch while she caught up with a bit of sleep, but I was in her bed.

Why do we insist that every child has to fit into the norm of sleeping 7-7?! If they don't then they need to be "trained". That poor, poor child.

Children that age generally need around 12 hours of sleep. Maybe 7pm was when he needed to go to bed. He was happy to play in his room if he woke before 7am. I dont see a problem here?

I agree that generally children that age do need 12 hours sleep. So if a child isn't slipping into that routine then surely there's a reason behind it?

 

[lau86]

I'm just wondering if they've really dealt with what was bothering him. He had a reason he kept getting up and instead of trying to find it out it seems like they've dealt with the symptoms not the cause. Has he stopped getting up because he's happy or has he stopped getting up because he knows they won't come? I don't know only the parents do but the dad just seems to have a very unloving view point I agree with other posters that it sounds more like he's talking about an animal

 

[LoraLoo]

Firstly, when my husband married me, it was for the good & bad times. If he dared to threaten to walk out on me if I didn't do things his way then I would be reconsidering whether or not he should be my husband.

Secondly, the phrase I hate the most is "he was fed, watered, dry & warm... what more could he possibly want?!" It seriously sounds like people are talking about animals with this. How about he wants cuddles, reassurance etc?! I understand there are children with sleep issues. I honestly don't believe that every child can just fall into line of sleeping 7-7. I've never slept 7-7, even as a child & my mum has always said it was just something she had to learn to accept. She actually felt guilty that she would sometimes put the TV on in her room for me to watch while she caught up with a bit of sleep, but I was in her bed.

Why do we insist that every child has to fit into the norm of sleeping 7-7?! If they don't then they need to be "trained". That poor, poor child.

Children that age generally need around 12 hours of sleep. Maybe 7pm was when he needed to go to bed. He was happy to play in his room if he woke before 7am. I dont see a problem here?

I agree that generally children that age do need 12 hours sleep. So if a child isn't slipping into that routine then surely there's a reason behind it?

I think each child is different, all of mine have been different - 1st didnt sttn til 4, 2nd sstn from 3 weeks old, 4th co-slept til 20 months old then sstn, 5th, well- we are still working on him

Even my better sleepers have tested the boundaries around the 2 year mark, once they realise they can get out of their cot/bed. 3 nights CC sorted that out and they went back to sleeping 12 hours a night. I dont think they would sleep if they didnt need it, you cant force a child to sleep. The parents said the little boy was grumpy and tired through the day, so obviously wasnt getting the sleep he needed.

Like I say, its each to their own, maybe they could have tried harder, tried longer, only they will know that

 

[Irish Eyes]

Firstly, when my husband married me, it was for the good & bad times. If he dared to threaten to walk out on me if I didn't do things his way then I would be reconsidering whether or not he should be my husband.

Secondly, the phrase I hate the most is "he was fed, watered, dry & warm... what more could he possibly want?!" It seriously sounds like people are talking about animals with this. How about he wants cuddles, reassurance etc?! I understand there are children with sleep issues. I honestly don't believe that every child can just fall into line of sleeping 7-7. I've never slept 7-7, even as a child & my mum has always said it was just something she had to learn to accept. She actually felt guilty that she would sometimes put the TV on in her room for me to watch while she caught up with a bit of sleep, but I was in her bed.

Why do we insist that every child has to fit into the norm of sleeping 7-7?! If they don't then they need to be "trained". That poor, poor child.

Children that age generally need around 12 hours of sleep. Maybe 7pm was when he needed to go to bed. He was happy to play in his room if he woke before 7am. I dont see a problem here?

I agree that generally children that age do need 12 hours sleep. So if a child isn't slipping into that routine then surely there's a reason behind it?

I think each child is different, all of mine have been different - 1st didnt sttn til 4, 2nd sstn from 3 weeks old, 4th co-slept til 20 months old then sstn, 5th, well- we are still working on him

Even my better sleepers have tested the boundaries around the 2 year mark, once they realise they can get out of their cot/bed. 3 nights CC sorted that out and they went back to sleeping 12 hours a night. I dont think they would sleep if they didnt need it, you cant force a child to sleep. The parents said the little boy was grumpy and tired through the day, so obviously wasnt getting the sleep he needed.

Like I say, its each to their own, maybe they could have tried harder, tried longer, only they will know that

I think Lau86 explained it much better than I did! It really does seem like they've sorted out the symptoms and not the cause. CC worked for your children and they obviously needed their sleep. To go to such great extremes of locking him in his room and listen to him screaming "like a caged animal" just seems like it's not a child that's testing their boundries. To me that sounds like real issues.

 

[Natsku]

I don't like that they let their toddler cry for 3 hours without going in to comfort him, I think CC would have been the better option but I don't see whats wrong with locking the door at night. It was for his safety. I basically lock Maria in at night as I have a stairgate on her door - its for her safety cos she sometimes gets up in the night to play and doesn't cry so I don't always wake up so I don't want the risk of her wandering out of her room as she can open the front door now and there's two flights of stairs outside the door - she could really hurt herself. Plus playing with the oven etc.

 

[LoraLoo]

I don't like that they let their toddler cry for 3 hours without going in to comfort him, I think CC would have been the better option but I don't see whats wrong with locking the door at night. It was for his safety. I basically lock Maria in at night as I have a stairgate on her door - its for her safety cos she sometimes gets up in the night to play and doesn't cry so I don't always wake up so I don't want the risk of her wandering out of her room as she can open the front door now and there's two flights of stairs outside the door - she could really hurt herself. Plus playing with the oven etc.

We dont know that they didnt try CC though, they said they tried everything. Like i say i personally think they should have picked 1 method and stuck to it, but everyone has their breaking point. I dont think they are bad parents for doing what they did.

 

[jenkins]

Loraloo - agree with you that's it's not just about the dad but also the mother too.

Personally if dh gave me that kind of ultimatum I'd Like to think that I'd tell him where to go BUT why was it so all or nothing? Why just that either the toddler was putting himself in danger all night or he had to be locked up?

Again, I only know what I've read so couldn't begin to go into their relationship dynamics etc. As he is the one who wrote the article for the world to see, I suppose that's why he's getting most of the backlash.

ETA I'm not directing those questions at you loraloo, just thinking aloud x

 

[lady_p]

I've not read all the replys just the last couple so sorry if I am repeating stuff. Its a difficult one I think if he could escape stair gates and was putting himself in danger of falling down stairs, hurting himself something had to be done but I agree with a previous person who said they would put his whole bed in their room I can see that this was a really desperate case and I feel thankful that my 2 are touch wood good sleepers.

 

[LoraLoo]

The obvious solution to me was the child co-sleeping with Mum and Dad sleeping in the spare room (seeing as he wasnt wanting sex anyway!). My Husband never felt comfortable co-sleeping and he slept on the floor for months, but you do what you need to do at the time, and what you think is best. In hindsight, it might not always have been the best option. But, we live and we learn. Parents are now happy and child is happy. Yes he cried for 3 hours. But it was 1 night, you have to put it into perspective x

 

[fidgets mammy]

Exactly, how many nights had he bn sobbing for before that?