Underhand tactics - formula companies

[Blah11]

Formula is a lot better in the 21st century, its full of everything a baby needs (all except mummys antibodies), but baby will produce their own antibodies...

It is a lot better, and since formula is here to stay, and no matter how popular or not it is or becomes, I hope that it keeps on getting better.

While formula does meet a baby's nutritional needs, there's so much more in human milk other than antibodies that isn't found in formula, though. Aside from it's obvious purpose as a nutritional source, human milk is fascinatingly complex in what it contains and to what end. Even now scientists are discovering things about it that they didn't know before, like this here: https://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/03/science/03milk.html?_r=2&emc=eta1

How interesting and cool is that?

I agree with you. Breastmilk changes with what your baby needs, and even what the weather is like! Amazing.

 

[Jkelmum]

The advert isnt underhand at all , its offering a helpline , I have breastfed 2 out of my 4 children and they are all healthy ...so to me is simple as long as the baby is getting fed no matter what way then thats all that matters ....I soley expressed for 14 weeks with my last baby as I hate breastfeeding ...also stopped at 14 wks because I wanted a drink , selfish not imo because a happy mum makes happy babies rather then me constantly being attached to a pump while tryin to look after four children

we all make the right choices for us ...and nobody else as a right to judge !

 

[Dragonfly]

Bottles , teeths and baby food are the same advertising laws as formula to. Its in the WHO code. https://www.who.int/nutrition/publications/code_english.pdf


Note in this they use the word Artificial feeding to.
THE CODE

In 1981, the World Health Assembly adopted The International Code of Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes, as a tool to protect breastfeeding. The Innocenti Declaration of 1990 calls on all governments to implement the Code by 1995.

Formula marketing targets women. New mothers are given free samples of formula, babies are given bottles in hospitals, coupons or food samples arrive in the mail, or booklets and videotapes are distributed on breastfeeding and weaning. The Code prohibits marketing of these products in these ways. It covers formula, other milk products, cereals, teas and juices, as well as bottles and teats.
The Code has 10 important provisions.

* NO advertising of any of these products to the public
* NO free samples to mothers
* NO promotion of products in health care facilities, including the distribution of free or low-cost supplies
* NO company sales representatives to advise mothers
* NO gifts or personal samples to health workers
* NO words or pictures idealising artificial feeding, or pictures of infants on labels of infant milk containers
* Information to health workers should be scientific and factual
* ALL information on artificial infant feeding, including that on labels, should explain the benefits of breastfeeding and the costs and hazards associated with artificial feeding
* Unsuitable products, such as sweetened condensed milk, should not be promoted for babies
* Manufacturers and distributors should comply with the Code's provisions even if countries have not adopted laws or other measures.

I cant find it on google but I did read that bottle, teets and baby food are all under the code hence why you dont see them advertised .

 

[leelee]

Bottles , teeths and baby food are the same advertising laws as formula to. Its in the WHO code. https://www.who.int/nutrition/publications/code_english.pdf


Note in this they use the word Artificial feeding to.
THE CODE

In 1981, the World Health Assembly adopted The International Code of Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes, as a tool to protect breastfeeding. The Innocenti Declaration of 1990 calls on all governments to implement the Code by 1995.

Formula marketing targets women. New mothers are given free samples of formula, babies are given bottles in hospitals, coupons or food samples arrive in the mail, or booklets and videotapes are distributed on breastfeeding and weaning. The Code prohibits marketing of these products in these ways. It covers formula, other milk products, cereals, teas and juices, as well as bottles and teats.
The Code has 10 important provisions.

* NO advertising of any of these products to the public
* NO free samples to mothers
* NO promotion of products in health care facilities, including the distribution of free or low-cost supplies
* NO company sales representatives to advise mothers
* NO gifts or personal samples to health workers
* NO words or pictures idealising artificial feeding, or pictures of infants on labels of infant milk containers
* Information to health workers should be scientific and factual
* ALL information on artificial infant feeding, including that on labels, should explain the benefits of breastfeeding and the costs and hazards associated with artificial feeding
* Unsuitable products, such as sweetened condensed milk, should not be promoted for babies
* Manufacturers and distributors should comply with the Code's provisions even if countries have not adopted laws or other measures.

I cant find it on google but I did read that bottle, teets and baby food are all under the code hence why you dont see them advertised .

It doesn't matter where it is mentioned, the point is that a lot of people don't like the 'usage' of the word artificial and people like you keep trying to back up the point and mention it again and again. I had never heard of the word until this thread.

You are just being unhelpful by bringing it up again and again. Have you absolutely zero respect for other people's feelings? Or are you more interested in making a point?

 

[MrsBop]

Seriously does it matter how babies are fed so long as they are fed?!!

I struggled for 3 weeks breastfeeding Noah and my body just couldn't produce enough milk, he was a big baby and we were both so unhappy, he was then formula fed, Mailie was breastfed for just over a year, occasionally had formula and I only breastfed as long as I did because I was taking so much medication, eating porridge til it came out of my ears and expressing pretty much none stop in between feeding, out of my 2 children Noah is the healthiest, hardly ever ill and been no worry physically, Mailie on the other hand is 17 months old (today) and is always ill, even had to rush her to hospital once so a breastfed baby isn't always a healthier baby!

 

[aob1013]

Some people say formula, some people say artificial
Some people say couch, some people say sofa
Some people say pram some people say stroller

......... it's just what you are accustomed to.

People are not going to change how they naturally word things because of a forum.

 

[BrookieG]

havent read all this thread mainly because its so so long!!! lol but the ff/bf debate is always always gonna be there why ppl cant just live and let live i really dunno...if you are BFing your child then fantastic i WISH i was able to but i simply couldnt, posts ive done on this in the past have resulted in the same old "the support is out there if you bother to look for it" well im sorry but not everyone has a gr8 support system i am in the process of filing an official complaint to my hospital because my aftercare was beyond disgusting. Would i like to be BFing my son? Yes I would but I cant so he takes formula and is a happy healthy little boy. He's gained .5oz every week since he was born, would he be any happier if i BF? No! IMHO he'd be a miserable little boy because he'd have a mummy who was constantly stressed and depressed (this is what i know of MY experience) but I really do get fed up of BFing mums who go out of their way to look for ways to slate FF companies...im at a stage just now that ive been made to feel so guilty about FF im terrified to ask for advice on it...i literally feel sick coz today i have to ask my HV about Ollie's feeding pattern with his teething....no mum shuold ever be made to feel that way just because of how they chose to feed their child, coz im aware there's 2 sides to the coin and BF mums get a hard time too....why not just accept that we're all doing the best WE can for our children and stop getting so uptight about adverts? i personally would use a helpline because i wouldnt get the "look" of "oh so you dont BF" I applaud mums who do stick through really tough experiences of BF and come out the other end of the tunnel still BF but my experience was so horrific to the extent i have nightmares about it i'll never put myself thru it again and that devastates me....what some ppl do need to realise is that although many mums DO choose FF which is gr8, some mums WANT to BF but cant....and they dont need to be made to feel guilty for the rest of their lives, i provide for my son, i feed him, he has a happy mummy and daddy because they know he goes to bed with a full tummy....what more do we want for our children....

anyhoo like i say ive not read this whole thread so im probably waaayyy off topic now lol

 

[Celesse]

Bottles , teeths and baby food are the same advertising laws as formula to. Its in the WHO code. https://www.who.int/nutrition/publications/code_english.pdf


Note in this they use the word Artificial feeding to.
THE CODE

In 1981, the World Health Assembly adopted The International Code of Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes, as a tool to protect breastfeeding. The Innocenti Declaration of 1990 calls on all governments to implement the Code by 1995.

Formula marketing targets women. New mothers are given free samples of formula, babies are given bottles in hospitals, coupons or food samples arrive in the mail, or booklets and videotapes are distributed on breastfeeding and weaning. The Code prohibits marketing of these products in these ways. It covers formula, other milk products, cereals, teas and juices, as well as bottles and teats.
The Code has 10 important provisions.

* NO advertising of any of these products to the public
* NO free samples to mothers
* NO promotion of products in health care facilities, including the distribution of free or low-cost supplies
* NO company sales representatives to advise mothers
* NO gifts or personal samples to health workers
* NO words or pictures idealising artificial feeding, or pictures of infants on labels of infant milk containers
* Information to health workers should be scientific and factual
* ALL information on artificial infant feeding, including that on labels, should explain the benefits of breastfeeding and the costs and hazards associated with artificial feeding
* Unsuitable products, such as sweetened condensed milk, should not be promoted for babies
* Manufacturers and distributors should comply with the Code's provisions even if countries have not adopted laws or other measures.

I cant find it on google but I did read that bottle, teets and baby food are all under the code hence why you dont see them advertised .

It doesn't matter where it is mentioned, the point is that a lot of people don't like the 'usage' of the word artificial and people like you keep trying to back up the point and mention it again and again. I had never heard of the word until this thread.

You are just being unhelpful by bringing it up again and again. Have you absolutely zero respect for other people's feelings? Or are you more interested in making a point?

She has made the post to link the Code. The World Health Organisation have chosen the wording, not Dragonfly. I'm pretty sure she has just cut and pasted it from elsewhere.

 

[Missy86]

Day 3 of a conversation going round and round haha

 

[New2Bumps]

if you look on the sma website though theres lots of information on
Breastfeeding
Bottle-feeding
Feeding problems
Baby nutrition
Weaning
Toddler development
Pregnancy
Taking care of yourself
Baby care
Baby development

i think thats all the page is advertising.. just because someone might go onto a formula based website doesnt mean that they MUST then use formula.. theres even a section on their website under the breastfeeding section thats is called "breast is best" so i think they are just trying to help give info to pregnant women about all of their options.. i dont think its underhanded in the slightest/..... just my opinion though...

Agreed!

At the end of the day, some people bottle feed, so why shouldnt they offer advice about other things?

EXACTLY

The world is NOT trying to discourage anyone to breastfeed. It's a choice and one that a vast majority of mommies make in an informed manner.

I tried breastfeeding for ages under very difficult circumstances physically and practially, I expressed for 6 weeks, then and now use formula. Ethan is amazingly healthy.

Thank GOD for formula and bottles or else it would be a very different story.

 

[Blah11]

WHO just give guidelines, they're not the law. They're giving reccomendations but obviously they're not followed here because bottles, sterilisers and baby food are regularly advertised and on offer.

 

[Dopeyjopey]

I think dragonfly said about them using the word 'artificial' as it was a quote and didn't want people to think it was her wording.

 

[Jolinar]

I'm just laughing at now at how oblivious some people are to the offense they cause. Can we not give each other a break? We're here for support not hitting each other over the head again and again with particular words.

The official term for being over a certain weight is obese, it's horrible and dehumanising and I certainly wouldn't use it in conversation to a friend. Give over it's boring already.

 

[leelee]

Some people say formula, some people say artificial
Some people say couch, some people say sofa
Some people say pram some people say stroller

......... it's just what you are accustomed to.

People are not going to change how they naturally word things because of a forum.

It isn't comparable - someone is hardly likely to get upset if you say they have a nice sofa and they prefer the word couch.

We can easily choose the adapt how we phrase things if we want to (within reason). I am not suggesting that we have to screen every word. However, if a certain word was offending/upsetting a group of people - why choose to go on about it and bring up articles to back it up? It's just rude and disrespectful.

 

[Shiv]

I would like to think that regardless ofhow I feed my baby that I could see that the point of the OP had absolutely nothign to do with bf v ff.

The point is this (IMO) - It is ILLEGAL to advertise formula for babies under 6 months old, so do you believe that this advert for a helpine run by a formula company aimed at expectant/new mums is making that association between formula and young babies or not? If your answer is yes then the advert is underhand, if your answer is no, then the advert is not underhand is just providing a helpful service.

My answer is yes, I think it is underhand (clever but still underhand).

Whether it should be illegal to advertise formula for babies under 6 months is a whole other debate, bf vs ff is a whole other debate, whether ffing should be called artificial is a whole other debate and I believe that Rach was not asking for these debates with her opening post.

All just my opinion of course

 

[leelee]

Bottles , teeths and baby food are the same advertising laws as formula to. Its in the WHO code. https://www.who.int/nutrition/publications/code_english.pdf


Note in this they use the word Artificial feeding to.
THE CODE

In 1981, the World Health Assembly adopted The International Code of Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes, as a tool to protect breastfeeding. The Innocenti Declaration of 1990 calls on all governments to implement the Code by 1995.

Formula marketing targets women. New mothers are given free samples of formula, babies are given bottles in hospitals, coupons or food samples arrive in the mail, or booklets and videotapes are distributed on breastfeeding and weaning. The Code prohibits marketing of these products in these ways. It covers formula, other milk products, cereals, teas and juices, as well as bottles and teats.
The Code has 10 important provisions.

* NO advertising of any of these products to the public
* NO free samples to mothers
* NO promotion of products in health care facilities, including the distribution of free or low-cost supplies
* NO company sales representatives to advise mothers
* NO gifts or personal samples to health workers
* NO words or pictures idealising artificial feeding, or pictures of infants on labels of infant milk containers
* Information to health workers should be scientific and factual
* ALL information on artificial infant feeding, including that on labels, should explain the benefits of breastfeeding and the costs and hazards associated with artificial feeding
* Unsuitable products, such as sweetened condensed milk, should not be promoted for babies
* Manufacturers and distributors should comply with the Code's provisions even if countries have not adopted laws or other measures.

I cant find it on google but I did read that bottle, teets and baby food are all under the code hence why you dont see them advertised .

It doesn't matter where it is mentioned, the point is that a lot of people don't like the 'usage' of the word artificial and people like you keep trying to back up the point and mention it again and again. I had never heard of the word until this thread.

You are just being unhelpful by bringing it up again and again. Have you absolutely zero respect for other people's feelings? Or are you more interested in making a point?

She has made the post to link the Code. The World Health Organisation have chosen the wording, not Dragonfly. I'm pretty sure she has just cut and pasted it from elsewhere.

I'm sure she has cut and pasted it from somewhere - but what is the point of it? To add fuel to the fire and annoy people further??? I had never heard the usage of the term 'artificial' until this thread. Certain people are aware that this term is offensive to others, so are we going to have it mentioned again and again in other threads too???

The point I am trying to make is to have a bit of respect for others on a forum. It is easy to say formula as that is what most of us called it before this thread anyway.

 

[Lu28]

Formula is a lot better in the 21st century, its full of everything a baby needs (all except mummys antibodies), but baby will produce their own antibodies...

It is a lot better, and since formula is here to stay, and no matter how popular or not it is or becomes, I hope that it keeps on getting better.

While formula does meet a baby's nutritional needs, there's so much more in human milk other than antibodies that isn't found in formula, though. Aside from it's obvious purpose as a nutritional source, human milk is fascinatingly complex in what it contains and to what end. Even now scientists are discovering things about it that they didn't know before, like this here: https://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/03/science/03milk.html?_r=2&emc=eta1

How interesting and cool is that?

That's a really interesting article thanks!

 

[Celesse]

Bottles , teeths and baby food are the same advertising laws as formula to. Its in the WHO code. https://www.who.int/nutrition/publications/code_english.pdf


Note in this they use the word Artificial feeding to.
THE CODE

In 1981, the World Health Assembly adopted The International Code of Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes, as a tool to protect breastfeeding. The Innocenti Declaration of 1990 calls on all governments to implement the Code by 1995.

Formula marketing targets women. New mothers are given free samples of formula, babies are given bottles in hospitals, coupons or food samples arrive in the mail, or booklets and videotapes are distributed on breastfeeding and weaning. The Code prohibits marketing of these products in these ways. It covers formula, other milk products, cereals, teas and juices, as well as bottles and teats.
The Code has 10 important provisions.

* NO advertising of any of these products to the public
* NO free samples to mothers
* NO promotion of products in health care facilities, including the distribution of free or low-cost supplies
* NO company sales representatives to advise mothers
* NO gifts or personal samples to health workers
* NO words or pictures idealising artificial feeding, or pictures of infants on labels of infant milk containers
* Information to health workers should be scientific and factual
* ALL information on artificial infant feeding, including that on labels, should explain the benefits of breastfeeding and the costs and hazards associated with artificial feeding
* Unsuitable products, such as sweetened condensed milk, should not be promoted for babies
* Manufacturers and distributors should comply with the Code's provisions even if countries have not adopted laws or other measures.

I cant find it on google but I did read that bottle, teets and baby food are all under the code hence why you dont see them advertised .

It doesn't matter where it is mentioned, the point is that a lot of people don't like the 'usage' of the word artificial and people like you keep trying to back up the point and mention it again and again. I had never heard of the word until this thread.

You are just being unhelpful by bringing it up again and again. Have you absolutely zero respect for other people's feelings? Or are you more interested in making a point?

She has made the post to link the Code. The World Health Organisation have chosen the wording, not Dragonfly. I'm pretty sure she has just cut and pasted it from elsewhere.

I'm sure she has cut and pasted it from somewhere - but what is the point of it? To add fuel to the fire and annoy people further??? I had never heard the usage of the term 'artificial' until this thread. Certain people are aware that this term is offensive to others, so are we going to have it mentioned again and again in other threads too???

The point I am trying to make is to have a bit of respect for others on a forum. It is easy to say formula as that is what most of us called it before this thread anyway.

The point is to link the Code that is being discussed within this thread, i.e. Formula Advertising and whether the helpline constitutes a form of advertising.

 

[Blah11]

havent read all this thread mainly because its so so long!!! lol but the ff/bf debate is always always gonna be there why ppl cant just live and let live i really dunno...if you are BFing your child then fantastic i WISH i was able to but i simply couldnt, posts ive done on this in the past have resulted in the same old "the support is out there if you bother to look for it" well im sorry but not everyone has a gr8 support system i am in the process of filing an official complaint to my hospital because my aftercare was beyond disgusting. Would i like to be BFing my son? Yes I would but I cant so he takes formula and is a happy healthy little boy. He's gained .5oz every week since he was born, would he be any happier if i BF? No! IMHO he'd be a miserable little boy because he'd have a mummy who was constantly stressed and depressed (this is what i know of MY experience) but I really do get fed up of BFing mums who go out of their way to look for ways to slate FF companies...im at a stage just now that ive been made to feel so guilty about FF im terrified to ask for advice on it...i literally feel sick coz today i have to ask my HV about Ollie's feeding pattern with his teething....no mum shuold ever be made to feel that way just because of how they chose to feed their child, coz im aware there's 2 sides to the coin and BF mums get a hard time too....why not just accept that we're all doing the best WE can for our children and stop getting so uptight about adverts? i personally would use a helpline because i wouldnt get the "look" of "oh so you dont BF" I applaud mums who do stick through really tough experiences of BF and come out the other end of the tunnel still BF but my experience was so horrific to the extent i have nightmares about it i'll never put myself thru it again and that devastates me....what some ppl do need to realise is that although many mums DO choose FF which is gr8, some mums WANT to BF but cant....and they dont need to be made to feel guilty for the rest of their lives, i provide for my son, i feed him, he has a happy mummy and daddy because they know he goes to bed with a full tummy....what more do we want for our children....

anyhoo like i say ive not read this whole thread so im probably waaayyy off topic now lol

Theres more support out there than the one your hospital gives. I appreciate that its a hit and miss when it comes to hospital BF help. There's numerous helplines and even on BnB the bf section is full of wonderfully helpful ladies. Theres also BF cafes who I'm sure would be happy to help ANY new mum who asked.

 

[Wobbles]

The advert isnt underhand at all , its offering a helpline , I have breastfed 2 out of my 4 children and they are all healthy ...so to me is simple as long as the baby is getting fed no matter what way then thats all that matters ....I soley expressed for 14 weeks with my last baby as I hate breastfeeding ...also stopped at 14 wks because I wanted a drink , selfish not imo because a happy mum makes happy babies rather then me constantly being attached to a pump while tryin to look after four children

we all make the right choices for us ...and nobody else as a right to judge !

You know what Serina, no matter what replies you get on this, neither me or the team will intervene if you get upset but I will if you purposely set out to flame/troll through FB again.