7th Natural cycle IVF(w/o meds) and finally BFP!

[bunyhuny]

dovkav, I am sorry about BFN but it may still be early, I did not get a positive until 13 DPO. keeping my fingers crossed for you.

bunyhuny, your clinic looks great. Do you know if Prednisone has any side effects in pregnancy? Probably not such a low dose but I am just curios.

Sorry this is out of context to your journal, Dov. Hopefully the information is useful to everyone!

I was given some info by a friend of mine who has to take Prednisone for her health. She has Lupus and Prednisone is one of the main drugs she has always had to use (for decades). She has told me that 5mg is pretty much the lowest dose and has very few side effects. 5mg is the level they had her on during her pregnancy. Her doctor said this is very safe for babies. (Her daughter is a happy healthy 2 year old now.)

Apparently, with Prednisone you can get some really bad side effects if you have to take it for a very long time or at a very high dose, but if it is just a low dose during pregnancy it is not a big deal.

When my friend was younger, she was on a high dose for over a decade, and after that long she began to get some of the major side effects, including osteoporosis which doesn't go away from what I understand. However, that was on a high dose over many years. I guess they didn't know that it could be dangerous until more recently. Now she is on a low dose and most of the non-permanent side effects have gone away.

The other side effects she said that can happen are you get stretch marks more easily. I already have those from weight gain after quitting smoking and again from more weight gain after trying FertilAid, so I'm not concerned about that side effect. You can also get excess hair growth, which I already get from my PCOS, so I'm used to that, too. The only other major side effect she said to watch out for is hunger. Luckily, I count calories, so I can monitor that as well.

 

[dovkav123]

BFN 13dpiui. I am feeling out. I'll test on Sunday again.

 

[Briss]

BFN 13dpiui. I am feeling out. I'll test on Sunday again.

are you testing with FRER?

 

[dovkav123]

I don't have FRER. Maybe I can get a special order from the pharmacy. I don't buy anything online.
Anyway, I have made an appoinment for sperm dna fragment. The results will be ready in 1-2 weeks. IVF lab will mix sperm with water and freeze it. And than they will transport it to another clinic.
Do you think freezing will hurt the sperm? Will results be actually worst than it is? Ejaculation in the cup, exposure to light would be already considered oxidative damage. Maybe he should do it in the dark? Maybe every men should do it in the dark for IVF or IUI?
I know that oxidative stress for sperm may happen already in the testicles. The longer they sit, the more they get damaged. For IVF sample you need to save for 3-5 days.
I am just hyper this morning. Tea is does it's job. For the first time I didn't quit caffeine after O.

DNA test will tell us a lot....I don't think we'll waste money..

 

[dovkav123]

CRM care in London looks like it's a nice clinic, but has not the best success rates. Do you know which one is a leading clinic in UK?

 

[Briss]

dovkav, I thought DNA fragm test is done with fresh sperm? why do they need to freeze it? I think half sperm does not survive freezing in certain circumstances it can be even more. maybe it's better for you to just go to that clinic that does the test rather than freezing it with your clinic? Actually our urologist said saving sperm for 3-5 days is counterproductive. clinic he works with ask for a second sample on the same day which is always of better quality (for ICSI it's the quality rather than quantity that matters so the considerable reduction in quantity of the second sample is not an issue). we were told to BD every day to improve the quality. but our IVF clinic told us to save up sperm for 2-3 days before EC which I now regret doing as DH's morphology was only 1%.

I just mentioned FRER (first response) as this is the most sensitive test I tried, all others were giving me bfns and only FRER gave positive

In London ARGC and UCH/CRGH as far as I know are considered top clinics but they have FSH cut off limit of 15 so they probably wont take me on anyway. no surprisingly they have high success rate, they just reject "difficult" cases. clinics like Lister and Create take on high FSH and older ladies but obviously their success rates are not that great because of that.

discussion boards relating to CARE clinic https://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?board=559.0

 

[dovkav123]

the sperm needs to be killed before dna fragm tests. My clinic sending it to the lab. We called the lab and they don't accept sperm samples, it needs to be prepared in IVF lab first.
I need this test done. My hubby is positive his sperm is fine, he'll never quit alcochol. He'll think double before drinking if he gets horrible results. Also drinking is not good for his depression and anxiety.

Otherwise we would do proxeed for 3 months and IMSI.
I give him all the vitamins, the same as are in the proxede bootle. I don't give him l-carnitine, acetyl-l carnitine.

to tell you the truth his 6 day sample last May was the highest ever with a morfology 19%
what was his dna ?

 

[Briss]

dovkav, I think you are doing the right thing. because my DH's morphology is bad so we do not need to do dna gragm we can safely assume it's bad as well but sometimes men have excellent SA results and great morphology so you would not think there is something wrong with the sperm and then random dna test comes back as bad, so better be sure I think

 

[dovkav123]

I am so fortunate that I have you, Briss!
I can talk everything with you even about sperm!!!
Nobody is interested in my problems, so I stopped talking about them. Nobody gives me a feedback, I don't think they don't care, they just don't know....
We are the experts here, we live for it and breath for it. For info and knowledge how to get preggo....

I did get BFN this morning at 15dpiui. I am quitting my progest. tonight.
My hubby told me we'll try again, we'll never give up. It seems to me we are doing baby steps and they are too small... IUI with one egg is really going backward not forward. But I am sick answering the same question "Are your tubes open?". After each IVF I had this thought behind my head maybe we can do it naturally, with progesterone and IUI. My hubby had this idea in the begining of our treaments.
When we went for IUI's first u/s, I felt sick and wanted to throw up thinking about this clinic that we are back again cos WE don't get any results....

yesterday I met a woman who had no children she was 84. Her appendix ruptured after the war. She blames this event for childless live.

My mother in-law was supprised to find out that I had a ruptured appendix too.(it ruptured in dr. hands, but we don't know what happened for sure. He just wanted to make us feel better, cos he misdiagnosed my problem for days.) My hubby's mom says "I see black". It means no luck for you guys....After failed 3 embryos implantation, she thinks my uterus is rejecting....She has no medical backgound, but I take all opinions to heart.
Could it be that scarring around the uterus(the outside) could prevent it move freely, and prevent implantation?

 

[Briss]

dovkav, I am very sorry about BFN, how disappointing still, I am very sure we will have our happy endings I just hope it will happen soon cos I am passed my limits here ...

i think if the dna fragm test comes back as normal then you would need to concentrate your efforts on your body. the reason my doc insisted I had Lap&Dye is because I had abdominal surgery in the past. I had a benign tumour removed from under my liver and it's possible that my right ovary is not doing well because of that actually, hard to say. anyway lap showed that everything looked fine. if you were in the UK I am quite sure they would make you go through lap as well. that's just something to consider. I am personally quite against any invasive tests but you did have surgeries in the past and seem to be traumatic ones as well so who knows there might be something there stopping the implantation. most of the time if they see an issue they can fix it during the lap. but definitely choose a good surgeon for this. I was very unhappy with my lap but it was free under the NHS so I did not have a choice of the surgeon, I still feel very bitter about the whole thing but at least I know everything looked fine.

I am very depressed cos I've been on B&B for ages and I have joined many threads where ladies struggled but then most ended up pregnant and I had to move to other threads. I am so tired of always being the last one standing when is it going to be my turn?? I really wanted to have 3 children but my I am approaching 38 so I really do not see how it's even possible

Do not compare yourself to this 84 year woman because she lived in a different time and surgeries were done differently back then. it is possible that her reproductive organs were damaged during her surgery but these days it rarely happens.

I am not sure how scarring outside uterus can affect implantation. if you think about it lots of women go through C section which is cutting the uterus and obviously having a scar (inside out) after that but they still manage to get pregnant again. a friend of mine had 4 children (the last birth were twins) all of which were c section. her uterus must have been all scarred from c sections when she got pregnant with twins...

 

[dovkav123]

I feel for you, Briss

Last year I found out my 2 cousins got preggo, this news drove me to start fertility check ups. Here is the news: my cousins spreading their baby's photos on the internet and we are still TTC.
I am glad that I don't hang around them, it would be more difficult.
We are good friends with one couple who were lucky with the 4th stim IVF. Her husband also was older 49 y/o. 1st IVF eggs didn't fertilise. 2nd one they did ICSI. We meet their little boy. I am not jealous. People who worked hard they deserve 10 of those...I do feel more comfortable with IVF cos I see this healthy little boy running around, who is super smart and cute.
Sorry you find yourself here for many years. It seems so hard to pick up and keep going after a bfn. Part of me is just ready to give up and move on. The other part of me can't imagine life without a little one of my own and forces me to keep trying - that part of me keeps shrinking!! Hang in there. I promise it gets easier... but it definitely is never easy.

I quit progesterone yesterday. I did temped after IUI. I can tell that progest. did a good job, my temps stayed nice and high.
This morning my temp is super high and I have a headache. Staying away from alcochol and having a tiny tiny hope.
I am pregnant till witch proves otherwise.
P.S. immortal optimist is talking here

I didn't have any discomfort or abdominal cramping after O after my appendix surgery. Very Painful gass or abdominal cramping during urination after O started just few years ago. I also didn't have O pains and fertile mucous. They did show up after I quit my birth control in 2007 or 2008. My periods became heavy and clotty. We used withdrawal method. With a good sperm and a healthy woman, it's possible to get preggo even with this method. I did push sperm up with my finger sometimes. Maybe if we started TTC after quiting my pill, we could bin lucky.
Possible I developed endometriosis. Birth control misbalanced my hormones.
I am so sorry about your lap. You were not happy...
I am very scared of Lap. I am afraid dr. will cut something out without asking me....My appendix was wrapped around my bely botton in the middle. I may have a very different anatomy, so dr. could injur my other organs. Many girls after 2 or 3 lap surgeries still end up doing IVF.

 

[dovkav123]

My hubby's heavy metal results in urine came back normal. Another good news!
sperm dna fragm is next.....
I forgot to tell you uring IUI I was told that I have a cervical canal 8cm long. I beleave an average is 3cm. Spermies have a long way to swim!!
I have read that 2cm short cervix at 24 weeks of pregnancy can cause a preterm labor.

 

[Briss]

dovkav, thank you. nice to have people in your life who understand how hard this is. I am not giving up but it's just frightening with every month my fertility window is getting narrower, I have less and less time…

great news on the heavy metal results!

re lap, I had a 15 min argument with a doc just before my surgery cos I refused to sign a paper allowing them to remove an ovary in case they cant remove the cyst without the ovary. It was very hard and the doc was so young and stupid, she said something like why do you worry you will still have the other ovary???? my anger is rising every time I think about it. but I did not go to the theatre until they changed the forms. if you cant remove my cyst without damaging my ovary then leave the ovary alone you stupid idiot (that's not what I said to her but I really wanted to)

How interesting about your cervical canal. 8cm, I have no idea how long mine is. to be honest I assumed it was very short like an opening, I had no idea it's at least 3 cm. that's super long, isn't it? maybe IUI is a way forward for you to make it easier for the spermies?

 

[dovkav123]

Sorry for

 

[dovkav123]

https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/05/22/feminine-hygiene-products.aspx

Furthermore, to give tampons and pads that pristine, “clean” white look, the fibers used must be bleached. Chlorine is commonly used for this, which can create toxic dioxin and other disinfection-by-products (DBPs) such as trihalomethane. Studies show that dioxin collects in your fatty tissues, and according to a draft report by the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), dioxin a serious public health threat that has no "safe" level of exposure! Published reports show that even low or trace levels of dioxins may be linked to:

•Abnormal tissue growth in the abdomen and reproductive organs
•Abnormal cell growth throughout the body
•Immune system suppression
•Hormonal and endocrine system disruption

 

[Briss]

dovkav, you are raising an important issue actually, I stopped using always' products a few years ago when they switched to perfumed pads. they used to have normal pads but then for some reason (probably cost saving) they replaced their products with really smelly ones. I hate the smell of perfumed tissues so I am now just going for the most simple pads available, our local boots' brand seems to be OK. I never use tampons though, just hate the idea of anything obstructing my free flow out.

Also, I am not sure I completely believe the article cos it might just be a marketing thing against always brand (as an alternative the author invites us to visit their on line store). I mean you do not need to burn their pads to find out they are made of synthetic fibers I think it's quite obvious, most pads are synthetic. Having said that, I will look into ordering some Natracare pads from amazon, they are a little more expensive than what I'd usually pay but I like the fact that they are organic. I could not go for Glad Rags Organic Pads cos they are reusable, that's just not something I can do really. I got some soft cups but they did not suit me, I just hate the idea of walking around with something alien up there.

 

[dovkav123]

It doesn't matter that an author invites to buy her products. It is obvious plastic or perfumed articles are not good for you.
We, children, grew up with cloth daipers, but now we use plastic daipers. I know that plastic daipers hold wettness longer, so many moms prefer to use them at night only. However, skin doesn't breath so it gets rashes. I'll stay away from them.
Cloth daipers I may try and see if they work for me.
My mon used a cotton for her AF. Cotton contains chemicals but lower amounts.
Soft cups are used to keep sperm in for longer too!!
They were super expensive in US.
Reusable pads, I would be interested in cos my flow is not that heavy.

My AF just came
I found a cotton and a medical band. I'll wrap it up and it'll work for me today!

 

[Briss]

dovkav, sorry about AF. What's your plan for this cycle?

I used cotton when I was a teenager – a complete and total nightmare + my AF is heavy and they leaked all the time, ruined most of my underwear so I am not going back to that. pads with proper wings is a way forward for me but do not mind a more organic version.

 

[dovkav123]

My 1st day of my period was very painful, I had sharp, stabbing pains, clots, the worst ever since last febr2013. I have pains on the left and right sides.
I hope my left lazy follicle has nothing to do with it. My dr. told me it'll disapear with AF.
I hope HSG flush didn't mess up my lining. I was only 1 day late. Often the cycle is delayed after this procedure.

I made an appointment for u/s on my CD 9. We'll see what's going on and we'll decide than if we do natural IVF or another IUI.

The cotton pad was horrible. It didn't leak, but maybe it was too big and hard, was not comfortable at all. I need to go to the store to get the proper ones.

When are your hubby's tests?

 

[dovkav123]

Doing IUI#2 on Monday.
My other ovary, Left one, has an 18mm follicle on CD9. On the schedule, like always.
My dr. suggested IUI anyways cos we havn't done many yet... She agrees we should give a chance. We'll take advantage of the freshly flushed tubes. She wouldn't do HCG shot either.
So will take her advice.
How are you, Briss?