"Ethics" of just one or two...?

Discussion in 'Pregnancy Club' started by TigerLady, Apr 23, 2009.

  1. TigerLady

    TigerLady CaveTiger Clan Mama

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2008
    Messages:
    23,148
    Likes Received:
    0
    Please let me preface this by saying I imagine this might be a sensitive topic. I absolutely do NOT want any offensive remarks or bickering over it. I simply am curious about what others think and welcome EVERYone's beliefs, no matter what they are. So, let's have a civil thread about this, please and thank you. :mrgreen:

    I heard a radio show today about the "Ethics" of limiting the number of children people have. I know all about gender selection abortions and other highly questionable practices which result from making this a legal obligation. I do not wish to debate the pros or cons of making legislation about this. However, I am curious if anyone has made the PERSONAL decision to limit the number of children they have and why?

    I ask because I, personally, am considering it. I know I absolutely do not want more than 2. And I would want less than that if my OH already had a kid(s). I figure 2 is replacement for us. However, we are discussing the possibilty of just one.

    There is such a thing as carrying capacity -- and it is a absolutely defensible argument that humans have reached ours (or even exceeded it). Technology is the only thing that has, thus far, prevented us from collasping as a popluation. When these collapses happen to other species they are often brutal -- starvation and disease is rampant.

    So, is it fair to our children, grandchildren, and great grandchildren to continue to bank on technology to keep us going? Is it fair to risk putting a future generation (of our own children) in danger of such a collapse?

    On the other hand, is it fair to expect parents, especially good ones, to make the personal choice to limit the number of children they have and nuture? I know many people find big families very rewarding. I am a firm believer in freedom of choice and the size of the family you have is a choice.

    So, what have you chosen? A big family or small? And why?

    My OH is talking about getting snipped right after this baby is born and I am not sure I am ready for that step. So, thank you for your input!!

    :hug:
     
  2. LadyBee

    LadyBee PQ and CT miracle boys

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2008
    Messages:
    10,603
    Likes Received:
    1
    Honestly, I never wanted to make the decison to have or not have children. I prefered to have that made by a higher authority. Now however, I find myself doing everything (naturally) possible to get pregnant. So am I fighting against a decision that has been made?? I feel that I'm not, but when it comes to deciding to take an action that voids out all possibility of more children (provided I have one already), I feel I can't fathom that. So, I prefer to let nature take its course.
    Good, thought provoking question hun~~
     
  3. Pyrrhic

    Pyrrhic Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2008
    Messages:
    12,995
    Likes Received:
    0
    I couldn't care less if someone had 1 or 20 children. Their family, their business as long as they know what they're doing, and can care for all children appropriately.
     
  4. NoSpringChick

    NoSpringChick Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2008
    Messages:
    1,706
    Likes Received:
    0
    This is also in this weeks Take a Break.

    The article makes sence in that the population is going to get out of control, but bar sterilising people how do you make sure people dont have more than 2?
    Human Rights people wouldnt allow this to come in I don't think, unlike China.

    We are just having one and wouldnt really want more than 2 I don't think.
     
  5. tasha41

    tasha41 Mum & Dad + 1

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2008
    Messages:
    24,247
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think people should have MORE kids in Canada.. the way things are going (our birth rate is lower than our death rate), children & the elderly will always out number people who are "working age".. which means a bigger load for those working & paying taxes here who are also trying to save up for their retirements & just survive day to day already. TBH while I completely disagree with some of China's practices and feel some of the government's methods are inhumane there.. I understand where they're coming from? It's just so sad.. imagine all the kids with no aunts, uncles, or siblings over there :(

    That being said, I really want to stick to just this one baby. I wanted 4 originally but I've had a rough time recovering so far, and I'm not going to be ready for a long time to have another.. to be fair to Elyse, I don't want to create a huuuuge age gap between her and a hypothetical second child. I'm only 4 years older than my younger brother and I still had to wait for him to be old enough to do things before I could do them with my family.. it felt so unfair and frustrating to me when I was younger to not get to go on holidays or to amusement parks, etc.
     
  6. applegirl

    applegirl mum of 1 and adopting

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2008
    Messages:
    12,717
    Likes Received:
    0
    My OH is big on the global population issue too. we will definately not be having more that two ummmmm - at the moment - we'd just like to get started with one sticky one PLEASE!! :rofl:

    In fact - we would like to have one of our own, and then adopt one. We have also talked about adopting two, especially if we do not manage to get pregnant ourselves.

    That being said, I certainly would not judge any couples who choose to have big families.

    What Tasha said is also important. In fact it is soooo common when discussing these issues to find that what is best for humans clashes with what is best for the environment :( The government would most likely want to encourage me to have more children, as they will most likely go on to become productive members of society, working and paying taxes. I can see that, and the need to continue to support the growing elderly population with wage earners, but if I see us all as citizens of the planet, rather than just of our own households, communities and nations then having more babies also means producing more people who will drive cars, take flights and basically produce a lot of carbon.

    The environment is definitely not the only important thing. Love for our families, committment to helping the people in our communities, excellence in sport, science, the arts... so many wonderful reasons to give and enjoy life!!

    I think that as mothers, we have something so important to do - we are going to raise the next generation, and let's make sure that we raise them to respect each other and respect the earth. If we can do that, then we've done a very good thing.

    Great thread Lady T. :hugs:
     
  7. marley2580

    marley2580 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2007
    Messages:
    6,264
    Likes Received:
    0
    We're choosing a big(ish) family, I certainly want more than two kids. Personally I think it's another way of governments shirking responsibility. It's not the developed world that has the population explosion, but the undeveloped one. Statistics and research proves that as the wealth of a country goes up, the birth rate goes down - so why not actually start doing something to raise counties out of poverty instead of making me feel guilty for wanting more than 2 kids? I'll tell you why, because it's cheaper!

    In the UK the only reason that the birth rate isn't falling dramatically is because of migrants from eastern Europe. I know loads of people that don't have kids, so surely if I have more it'll even out?
     
  8. wishingonastar

    wishingonastar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    8,136
    Likes Received:
    0
    i've always said i'd like 2 or 3 kids and thats cos i'm one of 3 and i've had some awful family situations arise which would have been extremely difficult had i been an only child as i wouldn't have had support from my siblings

    so from my point of view i would never only want to have one child as i would feel i was being unfair given i have relied a lot on my siblings so to have only one would deny my child that support

    i think people's influence on how many children to have comes greatly from their upbringing and experiences...

    i've never given thought to it from a population point of view other than when i read in the UK they are most likely to do away with state pension long before i reach that age because there will be too many of the elder generation and not enough revenue from the younger generation to support the public pension scheme... i truly don't know what the answer is...to have more kids or to have less for the futures sake!!!
     
  9. Elliebank

    Elliebank ♥Mummy to Katie & Ethan♥

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    15,095
    Likes Received:
    0
    We want 2, possibly 3. TBH though that's nothing to do with the population or anything, that's just how many WE want. I have nothing against people controlling how many kids they have, but I personally do not want to do that by OH having the snip or me being sterilised, it'd just be good old contraception for us.

    I do think it would be a bit extreme for yr OH to get snipped straight after the baby - how does he know he wouldn't change his mind in a few yrs when Otter is older? I think you really need to think carefully about that decision :hugs:
     
  10. Dizzy321

    Dizzy321 very proud mammy to 3!

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2008
    Messages:
    11,986
    Likes Received:
    0
    I agree. I was an only child and hated it!! I think the greatest gift you can give a child is a sibling. I will probably have 1 more child I always wanted 3 children
     
  11. lorrilou

    lorrilou Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2007
    Messages:
    5,340
    Likes Received:
    0
    TBH before i had kids i'd never thought about how many i wanted or would have, after having my first i knew i wanted another one, coming from a big family i couldnt imagine my child having no siblings. After my 2nd i said i wasnt having anymore, i have one of each but things happen and im now expecting my 3rd. This will be the last for me but not because of population issues just because 3 is probably the most i can manage to look after.
     
  12. angelstardust

    angelstardust mother of 3

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2009
    Messages:
    2,325
    Likes Received:
    0
    Developed countries, like the UK and the USA, have lowering birth rates. Whereas non developed countries have growing birth rates.

    I did choose to stick to two, not because of global population increases, but because it seemed right for us. Number 3 was a surprise.
     
  13. lisaandsprog

    lisaandsprog Mother of two, nearly 3!

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2009
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    0
    i think as long as that person can look after their children and provide financially then its totally up to them. However i do think that if you can not afford to provide finacially then its only fair and responsible as an adult to take precautions. I am having my third child. This will totally be my last purely because there is no way we could afford any more. There is a lady who lives near me, who is on her 8th child, living in a 2 bedroom place and on benefits. The children never wear any clothes that look new or even fit them properly, and i just think its a bit unfair to the children themselves.
     
  14. Wombat

    Wombat Married mum of 2:)

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2009
    Messages:
    1,444
    Likes Received:
    0
    I don't really agree limiting the number of children because planet is overcrowded or for any other global reasons.
    I myself would love to have more then 2 kids... But we are not going to. And the only reason why is that my pregnancies being so difficult I don't know if I would survive another one.
    Oh, and another reason in money. I want my kids to have good education, I want to be able to take them places etc. And I think that at the moment (unless of course something would change dramatically) 2 is the right number for us to give our kids if not the best, but good things in life. (Hope it makes sense).
     
  15. reallytinyamy

    reallytinyamy Mum and step mum

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2007
    Messages:
    4,210
    Likes Received:
    0
    the only thing I have ruled out is having an odd number of children, due to my own childhood.

    I used to sway towards wanting 4 but the way the country is at the moment I am seriously considering just 2
     
  16. AppleBlossom

    AppleBlossom Guest

    Although I hate the idea of having to go through a labour again I will be having one more. But personally for me one more is plenty. I would like Grace to have a sibling. But there are 3 of us, me and 2 sisters and there was always 2 ganging up on the other one. I think I would just like a small family but I know families who have loads of children and if that's what they want to do then fair enough. I don't think there should be a limit on how many kids you can have x
     
  17. Kiddo

    Kiddo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2008
    Messages:
    3,519
    Likes Received:
    0
    My sister is my closest friend and a huge part of my support network. There have been family circumstances that I think we'd have struggled to get through if we didn't have each other. I wouldn't want to take the possibility of having such a great relationship with a sibling away from my LO so I'd want to have at least 2 children.

    In saying that, this is my first, so we'll see how we get on with this one before we make any firm decisions!

    My reasons for wanting between 2-4 children are selfish and particular to our family rather than being influenced by global factors.
     
  18. reallytinyamy

    reallytinyamy Mum and step mum

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2007
    Messages:
    4,210
    Likes Received:
    0
    same here, I am the oldest of 3 girls and was bullied by them for most of my teenage years
     
  19. Blondie

    Blondie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2009
    Messages:
    1,959
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think we are going to aim for 2. I'm one of 5 and enjoyed growing up in a big family but I don't really want as big a family myself.

    I have no real objection to people having as many children as they want as long as they can support them financially. What I do resent (and I don't want to upset anyone here so I'm going to try and word this carefully) is people who see having lots of children as a meal ticket - ie bigger council house, extra benefits etc etc. I have no objection to people claiming what they need but when you see families with about 10 kids living in £500k houses specially built by the government just because a couple like breeding and sponging of the state it tends to raise my blood pressure a little :) I think there is taking the help that you need and then there is taking advantage of the system and having children just for the sake of getting more money.

    As I said - I don't want to offend anyone - I myself grew up in a council house (3 bed) with 4 siblings and although my parents did both work full time they did get support from the government so I know how needed it can be. I guess there is a fine line between right and wrong in my view :)
     
  20. Elliebank

    Elliebank ♥Mummy to Katie & Ethan♥

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    15,095
    Likes Received:
    0
    Completely agree
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice