Smoking while pregnant.. is it child abuse?

[ShanandBoc]

Those opposing the label have argued along the lines of "It cant be abuse because I, or my mom or sis etc did it" or "it is an addiction", but to me these are not reasons to refuse to acknowledge it as abuse. The rights of the mother have been argued, but like I said, her rights have never been absolute, and IMO these should be suspended for the duration of the pregnancy/nursing period. The law should recognize that the child should always come first. I have personally enjoyed this debate x

Wait, you believe that you should give up your rights as a human being simply because you are pregnant?!? That's a very extreme view. Where would you stop? What if doctors decided that pregnant women should spend the last month of their pregnancy and birth in a 'hospital' as that is the safest option for the child? Should women just accept that?

We are talking about smoking, not giving up your life , And yes, you should give up when u are pregnant. Spending time in hospital for the sake of a child cannot be likened to smoking??? Come on, this is just being ridiculous. Smoking isnt safe its no news flash.

We all know how bad smoking is, for the mother and the child. I dont even understand how anyone can even argue about it tbh

 

[ShanandBoc]

. The thought of others having a say about what I can and can't do simply because I am pregnant fills me with disgust. I may not agree with another's choices (ie smoking) but I do defend the fact that it is her choice.

.

There comes a point when others should have a say if a mother cant put her child first and cause her harm. Of course we cant make her do anything, but we are allowed to have an opinion, we are allowed to say' hey what u are doing is wrong, its harming your baby and thats not ok'

Are we not allowed to say something is wrong anymore? Simply cause its someones choice? We all make choices, to lie, steal, murder, cheat. Doesnt make those things ok just cuse we have freewill and have a choice wether to do those things or not, pregnancy doesnt change whats right or wrong

It may be her body, but im being the voice of the child. My empathy is with the unborn on this debate

What is your stance on smoking around a baby once its born, in the car, blowing smoke into its pram??

 

[Laura2919]

No one has said it is ok, we are just saying everyone has a choice to do what they want to do. I dont agree with smoking, I gave up when I found out I was pregnant. I lit a fag as soon as my test showed I was pregnant and I felt guilty and put it out but its not like that for everyone, it isnt just black and white for everyone.

 

[ShanandBoc]

I didnt say anyone said it was ok, i was pointing out we should be able to say that its not, without the argument of 'well, its her body she can do what she likes'.

Of course we all have a choice, i just dont know why anyone would 'choose' to smoke while pregnant.

It is black and white....you either smoke or you give up. You either choose to harm ur child or not.

 

[Laura2919]

In your eyes its black and white and its not in mine. Thats the difference of opinion. My sister has tried dozens of times to give up she just cant, she tried patches, the doctor sent her to a smoking clinic and nothing seems to work for her. Like I said I gave up when I was pregnant but it was HARD. I was lucky because I had the house to myself, I was living with my mum and dad at the time and they were all smokers, maybe if they hadnt been on holiday I might of not been able to give up. Who knows. Dont just judge it because you could give up because everyone is different and it might of been a breeze for some and it might of been harder for others.
You see it one sided because you did it, so did I, some didnt and.... who are you to decide what they should do...

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

Nothing in life is black and white because no one person is the same x

 

[ShanandBoc]

I never said it wasnt hard but love for chil should make u stop. Its not impossible. My dad smoked for 40 years, was a heavy smoker, tried many times to give up but could not do it. When he found out he had throat cancer, he quit, just like that. He had to. Why couldnt a pregnant mother do the same? For her childs life?

 

[PeanutBean]

We've all said it's not ok in our opinions however that doesn't give us the right to impede on others' free will. It's extremely simple, the line is drawn by birth and the dependent foetus becoming an independent person. There is no meeting in the middle, either you believe a foetus has rights or you don't. This is like theism versus atheism. One side can never understand the other.

 

[ShanandBoc]

Nothing in life is black and white because no one person is the same x

Its nothing to do with someone being the same or not tho, its about right and wrong

 

[Laura2919]

I never said it wasnt hard but love for chil should make u stop. Its not impossible. My dad smoked for 40 years, was a heavy smoker, tried many times to give up but could not do it. When he found out he had throat cancer, he quit, just like that. He had to. Why couldnt a pregnant mother do the same? For her childs life?

Because some women dont see the harm and in some cases you dont see the harm because not all babies are born low birth weight, with asthma or another problem. Who knows. I just know you cant judge everyone the same because unfortunately everything isnt black and white like you think it is.

 

[marley2580]

Those opposing the label have argued along the lines of "It cant be abuse because I, or my mom or sis etc did it" or "it is an addiction", but to me these are not reasons to refuse to acknowledge it as abuse. The rights of the mother have been argued, but like I said, her rights have never been absolute, and IMO these should be suspended for the duration of the pregnancy/nursing period. The law should recognize that the child should always come first. I have personally enjoyed this debate x

Wait, you believe that you should give up your rights as a human being simply because you are pregnant?!? That's a very extreme view. Where would you stop? What if doctors decided that pregnant women should spend the last month of their pregnancy and birth in a 'hospital' as that is the safest option for the child? Should women just accept that?

We are talking about smoking, not giving up your life , And yes, you should give up when u are pregnant. Spending time in hospital for the sake of a child cannot be likened to smoking??? Come on, this is just being ridiculous. Smoking isnt safe its no news flash.

We all know how bad smoking is, for the mother and the child. I dont even understand how anyone can even argue about it tbh

Actually, in the post quoted above we are talking about pregnant women having their rights rescinded in favour of a fetus. That could well mean giving up your life.

 

[PeanutBean]

Shan, how is it you don't see that 'right and wrong' is an entirely subjective notion?

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

Nothing in life is black and white because no one person is the same x

Its nothing to do with someone being the same or not tho, its about right and wrong

It has everything to do with individuality. Giving up smoking isn't just a physical act. You look at it holistic view physical, emotional, social and intectual. For example a lady becomes pregnant whom comes from a poor social background, abusive realtionship and is physically and mentor drained. Smoking could be her only highlight yes that is possible. The stress of giving up could be detrimental to her mental well being and tip the scale of her sustaining the power to cope. And then she self harms. Yes it is possible because it would be classed as a mental illness and I have seen women in this situation during my training. It's not as black and white as it's a babies health because if the mothers mental health suffers it can be detrimental to a babies health also x

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

ETA: I forgot too add sometimes weaning off smoking can be mire effective for the mother rather than stopping dead c

 

[ShanandBoc]

Those opposing the label have argued along the lines of "It cant be abuse because I, or my mom or sis etc did it" or "it is an addiction", but to me these are not reasons to refuse to acknowledge it as abuse. The rights of the mother have been argued, but like I said, her rights have never been absolute, and IMO these should be suspended for the duration of the pregnancy/nursing period. The law should recognize that the child should always come first. I have personally enjoyed this debate x

Wait, you believe that you should give up your rights as a human being simply because you are pregnant?!? That's a very extreme view. Where would you stop? What if doctors decided that pregnant women should spend the last month of their pregnancy and birth in a 'hospital' as that is the safest option for the child? Should women just accept that?

We are talking about smoking, not giving up your life , And yes, you should give up when u are pregnant. Spending time in hospital for the sake of a child cannot be likened to smoking??? Come on, this is just being ridiculous. Smoking isnt safe its no news flash.

We all know how bad smoking is, for the mother and the child. I dont even understand how anyone can even argue about it tbh

Actually, in the post quoted above we are talking about pregnant women having their rights rescinded in favour of a fetus. That could well mean giving up your life.

I was speaking on the subject of smoking in pregnancy only

 

[ShanandBoc]

Shan, how is it you don't see that 'right and wrong' is an entirely subjective notion?

I didnt say that it wasnt. But for me, the issue of smoking in pregnancy is wrong. There are some things that are clearly cut right or wrong, no one can argue that, and this is one of them.

Even if as Aidans mummy said, a mother is in a dire situation, its still doesnt make it right, thats the point ive been trying to make. I realise there are people that would find it extremely difficult to quit, i really do, and if they are in a horrible situation, and feel as tho they want to quit, then try, but its just too hard, then at least they have tried, i understand that. But, it still doesnt make it right.


That type of situation tho isnt the norm, so for everyone else that doesnt even try, then i still think its abuse.

This has been a very interesting discussion and for the most part, polite. But i feel as tho i really dont have much more to say.

 

[Lightworker]

Marley - yes that is exactly what I am saying - her right to smoke should be clawed back in order to preserve the health of the unborn child. She is not "simply pregnant" she is nurturing and looking after a child and is responsible, from the moment of conception, for ensuring that child is healthy. I am not too bothered if it comes off extreme to some people as long as ultimately, the health of the child is secured.

 

[Lightworker]

Now that Europe has declared that being subjected to second hand smoke constitutes "inhumane and degrading treatment" I think the same can apply to unborn babies seeing as they suffer the same, if not more severe effects of second hand smoke, and they have no choice in the matter. This may soon extend to homes, cars etc where parents smoke indoors with children present.

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

But sometimes when looking at the mental well-being and social surroundings a pregnant women whom is deemed to have mental health issues could be driven to self harm is told or made to go cold turkey. How is a mother harming her self any help to a baby? When looking at these things you have to have a holistic view of mother and baby. The mother is sustaining a life for 9 months if a mothers well-being is threatned by being forced to go cold turkey then so will a babies. X

 

[Lightworker]

Yes absolutely! I don't think they should be left high and dry by a smoke ban on them. Which is why I said previously that efforts should be made to ensure she engages in other stress-management activities eg yoga, therapy to deal with the psychological aspects surrounding the addiction etc.