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Viola Payne
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I've worked in hotels and I can assure you that far more contentious things happen in their rooms than someone being born!! It's sad that birth is viewed in a way that it needs to be hidden.
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Viola Payne
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I don't believe that borth is inherently dangerous, dirty, shameful or otherwise bad. I'm not going to modify my behaviours to appease those whose views of birth is negative (ie hotel owners who may or may not mind their room being used in this way)
TriChick
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I don't know if it's as much that the hotel manager would view birth as negative, but moreso that they carry a certain amount of liability for any incidents that occur on their property. Surely, by having previous hotel experience, you can understand the legalities behind their potential concern?
As I said before, I completely support responsible out-of-hospital birth, so long as all parties involved are aware and on the same page. Although you may disagree, by utilizing their facilities the hotel becomes part of that agreement. We are merely pointing out that they have the legal right to dictate what is permitted on their property, a contract you sign upon checking in. If they wanted to (not saying they would, but IF), they have every legal right to nullify the agreement and you could find yourself out on the street mid-contraction. As unregistered occupants, your midwives could likewise be removed from the property. Not the ideal scenario, but nevertheless quite possible.
As another member mentioned, have you looked into vacation rentals?? We have used them before, and greatly prefer them over hotel rooms when possible. Websites like homeaway.com have an extensive database of homes and condos available that are similar in price to hotels. Perhaps you could find a renter who is open to your plan?
As I said before, I completely support responsible out-of-hospital birth, so long as all parties involved are aware and on the same page. Although you may disagree, by utilizing their facilities the hotel becomes part of that agreement. We are merely pointing out that they have the legal right to dictate what is permitted on their property, a contract you sign upon checking in. If they wanted to (not saying they would, but IF), they have every legal right to nullify the agreement and you could find yourself out on the street mid-contraction. As unregistered occupants, your midwives could likewise be removed from the property. Not the ideal scenario, but nevertheless quite possible.
As another member mentioned, have you looked into vacation rentals?? We have used them before, and greatly prefer them over hotel rooms when possible. Websites like homeaway.com have an extensive database of homes and condos available that are similar in price to hotels. Perhaps you could find a renter who is open to your plan?
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Viola Payne
Guest
I'm not that noisy, no more than some people having sex.
The midwives put together a list of local accommodations. The midwives support women's \rights to choose where thy give birth, even if the hotel has its own policies.
The midwives put together a list of local accommodations. The midwives support women's \rights to choose where thy give birth, even if the hotel has its own policies.
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Viola Payne
Guest
@trichick - i believe the area of law you're talking about is called social host liability. I don't think under the law they'd ever be held liable for damages resulting from actions that they neither knew about nor condoned.
Id much prefer a vacation rental and i did look into this but it was too expensive. I'm self employed and don't get any mat leave benefits so i have to save every penny so i can have time with my baby. Last time i had to go back at 3 months and it was awful. I can't do that again. I'd much prefer to risk a hotel than to spend the money i save for my mat leave on a vacation rental. I looked into this and i'd have to rent for 2 weeks since they rent by the week and id need at least 2 since last one was born at 40+9 and you have to book ahead. The hotel is only $450, compared with 1K+ for a vacation rental (minimum).
I think there are some serious cultural discrepancies at play here.
Id much prefer a vacation rental and i did look into this but it was too expensive. I'm self employed and don't get any mat leave benefits so i have to save every penny so i can have time with my baby. Last time i had to go back at 3 months and it was awful. I can't do that again. I'd much prefer to risk a hotel than to spend the money i save for my mat leave on a vacation rental. I looked into this and i'd have to rent for 2 weeks since they rent by the week and id need at least 2 since last one was born at 40+9 and you have to book ahead. The hotel is only $450, compared with 1K+ for a vacation rental (minimum).
I think there are some serious cultural discrepancies at play here.
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elizah1980
Guest
I would feel guilty about the housekeeping staff who would see the aftermath of a birth. it is very messy, and they would probably be scared witless to open that room and see blood, possibly poo and bits from the birth everywhere.
I gave birth in a birth center which is friendly to natural birth, they hardly bothered me at all unless I wanted something, and when things didn't go to plan (which happens to lots of people....) they were stepping right in to help.
Also, don't use a hotel bathtub if your waters are broken. Once your baby is born, he or she can also aspirate that dirty water and if it has bacteria/viral particles in it that can be fatal.
I gave birth in a birth center which is friendly to natural birth, they hardly bothered me at all unless I wanted something, and when things didn't go to plan (which happens to lots of people....) they were stepping right in to help.
Also, don't use a hotel bathtub if your waters are broken. Once your baby is born, he or she can also aspirate that dirty water and if it has bacteria/viral particles in it that can be fatal.
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elizah1980
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do you have plans for how to dispose of your placenta? It's considered biohazard waste.
BabyCleo
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No one is meaning to be rude... im totally down for an out of hospital birth too!! Were just concerned for YOU... we would hate to hear that the hotel kicked you out or got a 911 call. You never know what happens during birth, and everyone just wants you to be safe, and your baby to be safe. It would be awful for hotel staff to figure out whats going on and burst in and kick you out. Or worse, someone calling 911... police showing up and busting into your room halfway through you pushing!!! They would probably call an ambulance. We all just want you to be safe and happy, and with no stress. Are there hotels that you dont have to sneak past? Just as another option? 
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Viola Payne
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"Are there hotels that you dont have to sneak past? Just as another option?"
I really can't imagine any hotel explicitly agreeing to this due to liability issues. At best they could turn a blind eye.
"do you have plans for how to dispose of your placenta? It's considered biohazard waste."
I kept ds' so I'm thinking i'll plant them both together with some tree seeds. I also know a woman who dehydrates and encapsulates them so i may do that, depending on how i feel at the time. I'm not sure if you meant storage? If so as it's a swanky one bedroom suite there's a full fridge with freezer. By the time we leave it'll be fully frozen and wouldn't have time to dethaw on the way home. Also, I don't view the placenta as a hazardous material as much as a view it as something that needs to be treated in a mindful and respectful manner and also as the thing that supported my baby's life for several months. I think placentas are beautiful and would never refer to one using the medical term "biohazardous waste".
"I would feel guilty about the housekeeping staff who would see the aftermath of a birth. it is very messy, and they would probably be scared witless to open that room and see blood, possibly poo and bits from the birth everywhere."
I wont' address the suggestion that i should feel guilty except to say that i disagree. Cleaning was addressed previously. Basically what is done is that plastic and sheets are wrapped over everything. In my experience birth isn't that messy. Where the actual labour occurs tends to be contained in one area. Again, there are far more disgusting things that happen in hotel rooms than childbirth, which isn't, imo, disgusting at all. What you describe sounds like a crime scene more than like where someone has recently birthed a child. Obviously it would be grossly irresponsible and plain rude to leave a mess like that behind, which is something i would never do.
"It would be awful for hotel staff to figure out whats going on and burst in and kick you out. Or worse, someone calling 911... police showing up and busting into your room halfway through you pushing"
I think this is overly alarming and not a reflection of what would be likely to happen in reality, at least not where i live, which is on a relatively small island with people who are generally laid back. In any event, i can't imagine hotel staff ever bursting through a door unless they thought there was imminent danger to life and property. And, I can't imagine remaining in the hotel room if there was imminent danger to a life as i would go to the hospital, nor can i imagine going totally mad just because i'm giving birth and carrying on in a manner that would make hotel staff believe that there was imminent danger to life or property. The standard for that kind of intrusion of privacy is quite high, and would itself carry risks in terms of liability.
My personal view is that childbirth is natural, beautiful and normal. I don't think it's something that we should have to hide, i don't think it's something that should be feared, and I really don't think it's disgusting or that the byproducts are disgusting. Giving birth anywhere should never be something that we feel guilty about, particularly not if we have chosen circumstances that we believe would be safest for us and for our baby. I will not be ashamed of the fact that i give birth, that it will involve some mess, or anything else having to do with it.
In terms of all the alarm surrounding childbirth, one thing i often think about is that human beings have been around for millions of years. We used to birth in caves. The outcomes in childbirth that are usually referred to when they quote maternal mortality are taken from the ealiest years of obstetrics, which involved barbaric and harsh practices done on women for reasons other than medical necessity. Prior to those times, when birth was midwife attended, it is my understanding that adverse outcomes were far more rare. This is to say that we are a resilient species and we've thrived as such. Nature didn't screw up and make us faulty so that we just can't give birth. And, our babies are more resilient than we give them credit for. Birth is a normal bodily function, the most beautiful one there is. And in every other case involving non human animals, it's done in the wild, and often with better outcomes.
I really think the way we view childbirth is all upside down, which is very sad.
I really can't imagine any hotel explicitly agreeing to this due to liability issues. At best they could turn a blind eye.
"do you have plans for how to dispose of your placenta? It's considered biohazard waste."
I kept ds' so I'm thinking i'll plant them both together with some tree seeds. I also know a woman who dehydrates and encapsulates them so i may do that, depending on how i feel at the time. I'm not sure if you meant storage? If so as it's a swanky one bedroom suite there's a full fridge with freezer. By the time we leave it'll be fully frozen and wouldn't have time to dethaw on the way home. Also, I don't view the placenta as a hazardous material as much as a view it as something that needs to be treated in a mindful and respectful manner and also as the thing that supported my baby's life for several months. I think placentas are beautiful and would never refer to one using the medical term "biohazardous waste".
"I would feel guilty about the housekeeping staff who would see the aftermath of a birth. it is very messy, and they would probably be scared witless to open that room and see blood, possibly poo and bits from the birth everywhere."
I wont' address the suggestion that i should feel guilty except to say that i disagree. Cleaning was addressed previously. Basically what is done is that plastic and sheets are wrapped over everything. In my experience birth isn't that messy. Where the actual labour occurs tends to be contained in one area. Again, there are far more disgusting things that happen in hotel rooms than childbirth, which isn't, imo, disgusting at all. What you describe sounds like a crime scene more than like where someone has recently birthed a child. Obviously it would be grossly irresponsible and plain rude to leave a mess like that behind, which is something i would never do.
"It would be awful for hotel staff to figure out whats going on and burst in and kick you out. Or worse, someone calling 911... police showing up and busting into your room halfway through you pushing"
I think this is overly alarming and not a reflection of what would be likely to happen in reality, at least not where i live, which is on a relatively small island with people who are generally laid back. In any event, i can't imagine hotel staff ever bursting through a door unless they thought there was imminent danger to life and property. And, I can't imagine remaining in the hotel room if there was imminent danger to a life as i would go to the hospital, nor can i imagine going totally mad just because i'm giving birth and carrying on in a manner that would make hotel staff believe that there was imminent danger to life or property. The standard for that kind of intrusion of privacy is quite high, and would itself carry risks in terms of liability.
My personal view is that childbirth is natural, beautiful and normal. I don't think it's something that we should have to hide, i don't think it's something that should be feared, and I really don't think it's disgusting or that the byproducts are disgusting. Giving birth anywhere should never be something that we feel guilty about, particularly not if we have chosen circumstances that we believe would be safest for us and for our baby. I will not be ashamed of the fact that i give birth, that it will involve some mess, or anything else having to do with it.
In terms of all the alarm surrounding childbirth, one thing i often think about is that human beings have been around for millions of years. We used to birth in caves. The outcomes in childbirth that are usually referred to when they quote maternal mortality are taken from the ealiest years of obstetrics, which involved barbaric and harsh practices done on women for reasons other than medical necessity. Prior to those times, when birth was midwife attended, it is my understanding that adverse outcomes were far more rare. This is to say that we are a resilient species and we've thrived as such. Nature didn't screw up and make us faulty so that we just can't give birth. And, our babies are more resilient than we give them credit for. Birth is a normal bodily function, the most beautiful one there is. And in every other case involving non human animals, it's done in the wild, and often with better outcomes.
I really think the way we view childbirth is all upside down, which is very sad.
Darlin65
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This all just seems so sketchy and absurd. Just where exactly are "you from"? Us, uk, Australia etc. Is your midwife properly certified because it doesn't sound like properly certified professionals would promote this. Just because you put down a plastic curtain the germs don't just disappear. It's not just the germs that will already be there but you are leaving behind bodily fluids that will not get proper clean up or the next person since the hotel has no clue what's going on. Home births are great but you have time to set up and make sure the area is properly sanitized. A proper professional would not support this sort of unsanitary environment and total disregard for the law. You are obviously breaking hotel policy which means what you are doing is illegal. That little contract you sign upon booking is a legally binding contract. The fact you say you've worked with legal situations further confuses me about this whole situation.
I honestly think that all of this is rather selfish and you need to accept that you have some limitations with your birth experience. Sorry, but there are plenty of us who didn't get the "ideal" birth experience. That's just part of life. I wish I could have had 3 months mat leave. You act like that is beneath you. If you can't afford the proper location that's life. Don't be a deceiving person who is trying to cheat the system. This is completely unfair to the hotel and future guests.
Yes, placenta is hazardous waste. Whether you want to "think" that or not. Things from your body left behind can cause harm to others including the housekeeping cleaning up your mess.
Sounds like you have no concerns for anyone other than yourself after your last post.
I honestly think that all of this is rather selfish and you need to accept that you have some limitations with your birth experience. Sorry, but there are plenty of us who didn't get the "ideal" birth experience. That's just part of life. I wish I could have had 3 months mat leave. You act like that is beneath you. If you can't afford the proper location that's life. Don't be a deceiving person who is trying to cheat the system. This is completely unfair to the hotel and future guests.
Yes, placenta is hazardous waste. Whether you want to "think" that or not. Things from your body left behind can cause harm to others including the housekeeping cleaning up your mess.
Sounds like you have no concerns for anyone other than yourself after your last post.
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I can't say I would be totally comfortable with the idea of having to sneakily use the hotel but certainly they're not exactly going to give you permission there. If its a hotel the midwives recommend as one that has been used before then I guess that's the best you can do.
I agree with the not using the hotel's jacuzzi though. Hopefully your midwives will be able to bring one and get it set up and filled in time. I do find it rather amusing all the comments about how gross it is to give birth in a hotel room when people will happily use hospital beds that have had all manner of bodily fluids on them too. Bring a waterproof mattress protector though in case you give birth in the bed. By bringing drop sheets and your own bedding and towels there certainly won't be any extra mess for housekeeping to have to take care of. I'm sure hotels have had accidental births happen in their rooms before, at least with a planned one steps can be taken to minimize the mess.
I think its a crying shame that such hoops have to be jumped through to have out of hospital births but good on you for thinking outside the box. Wishing you a lovely birth and a unique birth story to share.
I had to travel 3 hours in labour for my second baby. (Out of hospital birth was not an option for me as by the time my options were have a caesarean at my local hospital or find another option the only independent midwife in my area couldn't take me on as a client). I had planned to book a hotel to labour in as i had over 24 hours of early labour with my first but in the end, since i didn't have a midwife with me, im glad i decided to go to hospital first to get checked since I was in the car within an hour of the first sign of labour and she was born within 2 1/2 hours of my arrival and i wasn't in established labour when I got there.
I agree with the not using the hotel's jacuzzi though. Hopefully your midwives will be able to bring one and get it set up and filled in time. I do find it rather amusing all the comments about how gross it is to give birth in a hotel room when people will happily use hospital beds that have had all manner of bodily fluids on them too. Bring a waterproof mattress protector though in case you give birth in the bed. By bringing drop sheets and your own bedding and towels there certainly won't be any extra mess for housekeeping to have to take care of. I'm sure hotels have had accidental births happen in their rooms before, at least with a planned one steps can be taken to minimize the mess.
I think its a crying shame that such hoops have to be jumped through to have out of hospital births but good on you for thinking outside the box. Wishing you a lovely birth and a unique birth story to share.
I had to travel 3 hours in labour for my second baby. (Out of hospital birth was not an option for me as by the time my options were have a caesarean at my local hospital or find another option the only independent midwife in my area couldn't take me on as a client). I had planned to book a hotel to labour in as i had over 24 hours of early labour with my first but in the end, since i didn't have a midwife with me, im glad i decided to go to hospital first to get checked since I was in the car within an hour of the first sign of labour and she was born within 2 1/2 hours of my arrival and i wasn't in established labour when I got there.
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Viola Payne
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Breach of contract isn't "illegal"! The proper remedy for breach of contract is to seek damages (if there are any and assuming the rest of the cause has been proven). We don't send people to jail for these sorts of things (thank God).
Could you please specify what kind of danger future guests would be in if i gave birth there? Are you saying they could be exposed to certain highly contagious materials that i may inadvertently leave behind? I find this hilarious! I already said i'd clean up. Seriously? People do WAY nastier things in hotels than give birth!!!!! And leave WAY nastier things behind! Are you being serious? lol
Could you please specify what kind of danger future guests would be in if i gave birth there? Are you saying they could be exposed to certain highly contagious materials that i may inadvertently leave behind? I find this hilarious! I already said i'd clean up. Seriously? People do WAY nastier things in hotels than give birth!!!!! And leave WAY nastier things behind! Are you being serious? lol
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Viola Payne
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Sorry, that last one was for Darlin65.
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Viola Payne
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Sorry Darlin, i see that you're from the US so maybe they do send people to jail for simple breach of contract where you are. Where i live that doesn't happen.
Darlin65
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I don't believe I said "jail" anywhere in my post. Not everything illegal results in jail time.
Again you are leaving out so much that people keep asking about your birth plan and its not that we don't believe you will clean up but that it will be done properly.
Like others have stated, you aren't having an accidental birth there. You are going in with your plans already laid out without permission. Completely different.
Think I will camp out at the local department store with this one since rules just have gone out the window for pregnant ladies because, we'll, it's what I want. I can even hide in the clothes racks to sneak past security...smh.
Again you are leaving out so much that people keep asking about your birth plan and its not that we don't believe you will clean up but that it will be done properly.
Like others have stated, you aren't having an accidental birth there. You are going in with your plans already laid out without permission. Completely different.
Think I will camp out at the local department store with this one since rules just have gone out the window for pregnant ladies because, we'll, it's what I want. I can even hide in the clothes racks to sneak past security...smh.
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Viola Payne
Guest
In order for something to be illegal there has to be a law which prohibits that action. Where i live there is no law that says that a person must keep their promises or not break contracts. Instead there is a complex body of legal decisions that dictate what the remedies are for breach of contract, which does not make breach of contract illegal. It's similar to how a spouse may be able to sue a former spouse in negligence for damages that result from cheating, yet cheating isn't illegal.
Again, I'd ask you to substantiate your claims that it's as dangerous as you claim wiht some examples of what sort of adverse effects future guests might have if they come into contact with my "bio hazardouss waste" or whatever else you think i might leave behind that's specific to childbirth.
Again, I'd ask you to substantiate your claims that it's as dangerous as you claim wiht some examples of what sort of adverse effects future guests might have if they come into contact with my "bio hazardouss waste" or whatever else you think i might leave behind that's specific to childbirth.
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