TTC 1st child 35+ (Please spoiler any PG news/announcements).

[Dwrgi]

Not much going on with me. We have decided to try IVF. It will be expensive but so worth it. I want to be a mommy so much. My cousin called me a couple of days ago and told me she was pregnant. After we got off the phone I burst into This will be her 3rd child. don't get me wrong, I am very Happy for her but crushed at the same time because I want what she has. I tried to talk to her about my dh and I going for IVF...and she answers back with pity in her voice (for me). Sorry to come back after all this time and vent but I knew this was the place to come to.

Hello Stranger! How are you? It's good to see you back-I think of you often, going to your favourite Malibu restaurant and enjoying life. So pleased that you have decided to go for IVF-yes, it will be worth every penny once you get your own little bb. I am sooooooo rooting for you! God, stories about your cousin, it never ends does it??? Like I said on here before, I wouldn't be at all surprised if my 93 year old neighbour announced she was pregnant. Pregnant women are everywhere-sigh.

Anyway, good to have you back and stay with us!! We are all here to help you!

I also wish Missy T would come back but she has also gone completely AWOL. Just hope she is okay.

Lots of love hun
Axxx

 

[Dwrgi]

Dwrgi "Old eggs" excuse is endocrinologists life saver so don't listen to that. Why did they take u in the first place if they thought your eggs were bad? And why are they offering a second time with a different trigger? The trigger promotes more egg growth while waiting and I bet they used a strong med and a strong trigger for you. So probably eggs grew too quickly and popped before the collection. Your stims wasn't even 10 days if I remember correctly. For women who have low egg reserves they try to make the egg growth slowly so that they have a more controlled growth and the little ones can catch up and mature.
I love your Video, it's so inspiring. Hope you can sort out all the beureaucracy etc Hugs and love.

XXXXXX To all. have a great weekend girls.

This is EXACTLY what I think, and I have been grappling with this for weeks. I showed this to OH and for the first time, he started to think that perhaps I was right. The worst thing now is that he has decided (without any basis of fact) that our 'issue' is with my eggs (doh-poor sperm count and motility, my sweetness?) and is skipping his vits. I could scream! It is one battle after the next!

Can I just ask, at ARGC they took a blood sample from you every day-what was this for??

Anyway, I hope you are managing to rest, and that Shirin has settled back down. I am certain she felt your reaction and got excited too.

Have a lovely Sunday, hun,
Axxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

[Dwrgi]

You will ALL notice that AT LAST I have finally managed to post in response to PART of another user's message!!!!

I am special needs no longer!!!!!!!

 

[purplelou]

well done Dwrgi!!!

and welcome back luvmydoggies - we missed you!

 

[Desperado167]

well done Dwrgi!!!

and welcome back luvmydoggies - we missed you!

Purple,how are you huni?

 

[Tititimes2]

You will ALL notice that AT LAST I have finally managed to post in response to PART of another user's message!!!!

I am special needs no longer!!!!!!!

LOVE it! Go Dwrgi!

 

[skye2010]

Dwrgi well done for figuring out how to do posh quoting. Hahahhahahahahhaahaha!!!!
I'm glad your DH is getting to be more interested in the whole IVf procedure. Mine was exactly the same. He was very uninterested in the beginning but as time went by and we couldn't conceive he got desperate himself and started searching for the best solution we could get our hands on. In fact it was him who found the HFEA website and ARGC results. But he still skipped the vits. I just kept nagging. Bit deterrent No? So he sort of gave in just not to be subject to my nags. Hahahhahaha.Especially the drinking and smoking. I would have an absolute fit if he smoked or passed the 2-3 drinks a day or more than twice a week. He realised it was so expensive and difficult the whole thing was in the end.

ARGC's head dr is a very sharp guy, completely obsessed with hormone levels. He sees very few of the patients himself but checks all the notes and blood results of every woman daily. He starts with the highest dose of meds and gradually decreases it. Also he uses 2 types of meds Fostimon and Merional. One of them raises the eastrogen where as the other raises the Lh I think. So he switches between them depending on your levels. After reading the blood results he gives instructions for the day. How much dose and the exact time. Sometimes you get an instruction to shoot it now, sometimes at 8pm or sometimes even later. I think he instructs the minumum meds as possible to make a slow change than keep adjusting as he goes along. Bit like mixing paint. Second week of the stimms you get one blood scan in the morning and one in the afternoon. Quite different, but apparently women secrete hormones both early morning and after lunch. I guess he compares the change in the result to decide what to do next. Even the trigger was given different doses to each of us. I had to shoot 1 and a half dose. So I had to squirt half of the vial out. He does some of the collections and transfers himself. I never got to meet him though )
That's all I can think of now. xx
I missed Missy too actually

Keeky I remember someone mention that a clinic do a tx without the hormone supplements. I don't know if it is possible though. Your oncologist would know best about all this. Hugs!!!

 

[HappyAuntie]

Hello my lovelies! I've missed you! Sorry I've been AWOL all week (if not longer). It's just been a weird week, and my thoughts are so all over the place that every time I start a post I've been unable to finish it for one reason or another.

We decided to go ahead and do treatment this month (the emotions of which are probably why I'm having a hard time concentrating lately). I started stims on Tuesday (exactly the same protocol as last time, since that's what worked) and had my first follie check yesterday. Looks like I'll have three good follies this time - after 4 days of stims, I had one at 11 and two at 10 (and several little ones around 7). Last time I only had two and got pregnant, so while I used to get excited about three, now I'm a little scared I could end up like Austin (a grad who just had trips after IUI))! The next follie check is tomorrow morning, and the IUI should be toward the end of this week.

SO much has happened around here in the last week that I can't even remember everything I wanted to comment on!

HUGE welcome back to Titi and Luvvie!!

OMM, DE is a very personal decision, and I think we're all mature enough here to recognize that. I imagine your thoughts on the matter will continue to go back and forth, even after you start treatment. When you and your DH start to second-guess yourselves and doubt the choice you made, go back and remind yourselves of why you made the decision. You might even want to write down all the reasons why you're choosing DE now and date it, so that when questions do come up again, you can refer to that letter you wrote to yourselves and remember why you chose it. Hooray for the from the high-risk dr! But seriously, why do some drs only tell us what they think we want to hear instead of just being straightforward with us? IMO there's no excuse for him telling you one thing and your RE another. I'm glad you were able to get that straightened out. I know it feels like you're waiting forever before you can get started, but it will be here before you know it.

Padbrat, I am SO excited for you!!!! How exciting to imagine what your donor looks like - it really does make it more real! At my clinic's DE program, they show you a picture of the potential donors as toddlers (in addition to stats about what they look like, height, weight, education level, etc) so you can see what they looked like as LOs for yourself without compromising their anonymity... any chance you could get a baby pic of your donor?

Twinkle, I'm glad the HSG went smoothly.

Dwrgi, congrats on graduating from special needs! Keep working on sorting out your next steps. IVF is truly a trial-and-error process - the drs have no idea how that first round is going to go because they cannot accurately predict how your body is going to respond until you get started. That's why an individual's chances of IVF success go up if you go through more than one round. My counselor likes to tell me to view IVF as a very expensive diagnostic test that might produce a pregnancy as a bonus, not as a way to get pregnant. The drs can learn a LOT by observing what happens during that first round - how your body responds to stims, how the sperm behave, how fertilization goes, whether or not implantation is successful, etc. So keep at it - if you are willing and able to try again, your clinic (or any other you choose to go to) will be able to take what they learned from this first round and apply it to a second, hopefully giving you a better shot at a baby.

Big to everyone else.

 

[padbrat]

Hey lovely ladies! How are we all?

Skye and HA, I meant to ask your opinons (O Oracles of all things IVF related) on the meds they have prescribed? I start steriods in a week or so ish... Not that I have any reason to suppose the drugs are wrong.. just nice to get opinons. LOL

OMM so pleased you have come to a decision hun. I can completely understand what you mean about changing your mind back and forth... we did exactly the same... numerous times.. though it does feel great to make a decision!

Hey Butterfly... happy packing chick!! Hope you catch that O eggy!

Hey Titi... welcome to this crazy world of IVF related stuff... that I have no idea about... but hey, it is like a magical mystery tour... who knows where it will end up with!! LOL

DWRGI... I have a confession... I still don't know how to do the purple boxes thing... I am still special needs.... *sighs... just as I am with IVF stuff .... * sigh sigh

Purps! Hello chicken! Well done on getting that essay done and channelling your energy productively!! I know I would not be anywhere near as disciplined as you!

Twinks.. well done on bravely going through the HSG. It is over and done with now hun!

Hey all lurky ladies... FM, Never, bear, North xx

AFM... well the injections seem to be going OK. I stop the pill on Tuesday... Good Idea HA about the baby photo... I will ask.

 

[skye2010]

Woow HA well done on going ahead finally ) Good luck with it . Don't worry about the outcome just yet ) I hope you get your lovely little baby with this tx. Many sticky baby dust. xxxx

Debs what's the question sweetie didn't get that. You are not doing any stimms are you so now they are just getting your lining ready I imagine.
I got prescribes steroids as well. I think it was around 10mg a day and I used it for almost 2 months after the BFP. It is to supress the immune system.

 

[HappyAuntie]

And to wade into the ongoing PGD discussion...

The reason PGD for aneuploidy (random/uninherited chromosomal error, also called PGS/pre-implantation genetic screening) is not standard for all IVF cycles is because the science just is not there yet. Theoretically, PGD should find every bad embryo and allow only chromosomally normal embryos to be transferred. But for reasons scientists still don't completely understand, studies have shown that it has a very high error rate - false positives/false negatives almost 50% of the time - meaning that roughly half the time, normal embryos are discarded because they've been falsely diagnosed as abnormal, and vice versa. The studies have even shown that when used to compensate for advanced maternal age, recurrent implantation failure or recurrent miscarriage, PGD actually results in lower success rates (implantation, clinical pregnancy and live birth rates) than IVF cycles without PGD. That is why, at this point in time, neither the ASRM (American Society for Reproductive Medicine) nor the SART (Society for Assisted Reproductive Technology) recommend PGD for aneuploidy as a way to reduce miscarriage rates. It is also why most US insurance companies will not cover the procedure when it is done strictly because of AMA or recurrent miscarriage. (When PGD is done to diagnose a known inherited disorder, like cystic fibrosis or a translocation for example, the procedure works much better and is much more successful - I guess because it's easier to check one known chromosome for a known error than it is to screen ALL chromosomes for any possible error.) It's an area where more research is desperately needed, and more research is very difficult to accomplish in the US because of political constraints - there is a prohibition on spending federal money to conduct research on embryos.

Here's some basic info:

However, PGD (referred to as PGS in Europe) for routine aneuploidy screening during IVF for infertile couples has recently come under severe criticism in Europe owing to several prospective, randomized control studies in Holland and Belgium. PGS has failed to show any improvement in IVF clinical outcome per initiated cycle for advanced maternal age, nor for recurrent implantation failure.

In European studies of even younger, infertile couples, only 36% of embryos subject to PGD were found to be chromosomally normal. When embryos diagnosed as chromosomally abnormal on Day 3 (and, therefore, not transferred to the patient) were re-examined on Day 5, only 54% turned out to have that abnormality. This discordance appears to be mostly due to the wide prevalence of embryo mosaicism. This means that some of the cells in many embryos are normal and some are abnormal. About 50% of embryos in the European studies have thus been found to be mosaic. Therefore, the use of PGS may result in good embryos being discarded (diagnosed as abnormal) and abnormal embryos (diagnosed as normal) being transferred.

This website has a long but pretty clear explanation of the issues in lay terms.

Here's a summary from the New England Journal of Medicine.

Here's a summary from the Genetics and Public Policy Center at Johns Hopkins University.

If DH and I go to IVF, we will not be doing PGD. If it cost a couple hundred bucks or if it were more successful, we'd do it. But we're not willing to pay several thousand extra dollars for a procedure that has a lower success rate and gets the answers wrong a significant portion of the time. That's just my two cents'.

 

[twinkle1975]

HA - you are like our Google - you know everything|!!

 

[purplelou]

Hi Ladies, Hope you have all had a nice weekend!

Pad- how are those nasty injections going? I hope they are not too sore. how exciting that you get to know some of your donor's characteristics!

HA - I am rooting for you with this cycle. You seem to be such a strong person - I am in awe of you, although this whole ttc business is such an emotional one, you have been so brave in making the descision.

Omm - how are you doing ? I do not envy you choice of own od DEs. but whichever you end up choosing - that'll be the right choice for you!

Dwrgi - I struggle to get my DH to take his vits too, I leave them out where he can see them, but he manages to get around them, I wish I had advice for you on that one!

hi to the lurking ladies - never, northstar, FM, bearlake, keekee - hope you are ok

Hi Despie how are you sweetie? Im doing good thank you.

wooly - I hope you're ok and feeling better, Im missing you !

Luv & Titi - I think you are in the right place here with IVF treatments, since a lot of the wonderful ladies here are also doing the same, I will be cheering for you all

Forever - how are you feeling?? are you all ready to get started on your next cycle?

Twinkle- how are you feeling after you hsg? I hope there aren't any after effects or discomfort after that.

Skye - have you recovered from you shock with the heparin needle? I hope so.

Butterfly - how are the arrangements for coming back to the UK coming along??

Lava - I am still very excited about you lieelt boy and girl - have you been thinking about names?

also, anyone who visits the Grads thread, how is MA and Amelia doing? I feel too cheeky going over there.

Im know I missed somebody - sorry if that is you x

huge from me to you all xxx

afm - well, only 4 days to go till the scan... I have kept myself very busy, but DH and I have talked about it today. he is going to come with me and then we will see what is there (or not as I feel the case will be) I am going to speak to the haematolgy nurse after the scan, and she hopes to have the blood results for me then, and will speak to the consultant if need be then too. Hope this week goes quickly now!

 

[purplelou]

the information on PGD is very interesting HA, I guess in years to come it will become more accurate when the embryologists are able to identify more genes and what they do etc.

 

[HappyAuntie]

HA - you are like our Google - you know everything|!!

LOL - only on things I've already looked in to for myself, which brings me to Deb's question:

Skye and HA, I meant to ask your opinons (O Oracles of all things IVF related) on the meds they have prescribed? I start steriods in a week or so ish... Not that I have any reason to suppose the drugs are wrong.. just nice to get opinons. LOL

I have no idea! Most of the drugs have different names over here, so I'm not familiar with the ones you're on. But if you have questions about them, call the clinic and ask - it's their job to explain things in a way you can understand. My advice is always to ask when in doubt. Ask, ask, ask. I am not afraid of being a pain in the ass at my clinic!

 

[purplelou]

Pad - steroids (or prednisolone - commonly used in the UK) are used as an anti inflammatory, I give them to people having asthma exacerbations for example, to relieve the inflammation in the airways, they also treat inflammation which happened as a result of auto immune diseases too. Im with HA - ask if you are not sure, cos it's your body that these meds are going in to. (also they can keep you awake at night time - so take them in the morning if possible)

 

[luvmydoggies]

I still need to catch up on reading whats been going on.

Twinkle- I luv your avatar. I feel the same way.

Dwrgi- How are you lovely? I have thought about you too!!!

Skye,HA,Pad,Missy, Despi, purple,omm,futuremommie...all of you!

Lava (congrats on boy& girl twins)

We are not starting IVF quite yet, we are trying to get the money together first. As soon as we have it, we will go back to our RE and just go for it. Whatever he suggests. I'm estimating a few months till we can afford it.

luv to you all.

 

[twinkle1975]

Purple - MA & Amelia are ok - she's swollen & uncomfy from what she says - but Amelia should be here some time next week - depends on what they say on Tues I think!

 

[onmymind17]

And to wade into the ongoing PGD discussion...

The reason PGD for aneuploidy (random/uninherited chromosomal error, also called PGS/pre-implantation genetic screening) is not standard for all IVF cycles is because the science just is not there yet. Theoretically, PGD should find every bad embryo and allow only chromosomally normal embryos to be transferred. But for reasons scientists still don't completely understand, studies have shown that it has a very high error rate - false positives/false negatives almost 50% of the time - meaning that roughly half the time, normal embryos are discarded because they've been falsely diagnosed as abnormal, and vice versa. The studies have even shown that when used to compensate for advanced maternal age, recurrent implantation failure or recurrent miscarriage, PGD actually results in lower success rates (implantation, clinical pregnancy and live birth rates) than IVF cycles without PGD. That is why, at this point in time, neither the ASRM (American Society for Reproductive Medicine) nor the SART (Society for Assisted Reproductive Technology) recommend PGD for aneuploidy as a way to reduce miscarriage rates. It is also why most US insurance companies will not cover the procedure when it is done strictly because of AMA or recurrent miscarriage. (When PGD is done to diagnose a known inherited disorder, like cystic fibrosis or a translocation for example, the procedure works much better and is much more successful - I guess because it's easier to check one known chromosome for a known error than it is to screen ALL chromosomes for any possible error.) It's an area where more research is desperately needed, and more research is very difficult to accomplish in the US because of political constraints - there is a prohibition on spending federal money to conduct research on embryos.

Here's some basic info:

However, PGD (referred to as PGS in Europe) for routine aneuploidy screening during IVF for infertile couples has recently come under severe criticism in Europe owing to several prospective, randomized control studies in Holland and Belgium. PGS has failed to show any improvement in IVF clinical outcome per initiated cycle for advanced maternal age, nor for recurrent implantation failure.

In European studies of even younger, infertile couples, only 36% of embryos subject to PGD were found to be chromosomally normal. When embryos diagnosed as chromosomally abnormal on Day 3 (and, therefore, not transferred to the patient) were re-examined on Day 5, only 54% turned out to have that abnormality. This discordance appears to be mostly due to the wide prevalence of embryo mosaicism. This means that some of the cells in many embryos are normal and some are abnormal. About 50% of embryos in the European studies have thus been found to be mosaic. Therefore, the use of PGS may result in good embryos being discarded (diagnosed as abnormal) and abnormal embryos (diagnosed as normal) being transferred.

This website has a long but pretty clear explanation of the issues in lay terms.

Here's a summary from the New England Journal of Medicine.

Here's a summary from the Genetics and Public Policy Center at Johns Hopkins University.

If DH and I go to IVF, we will not be doing PGD. If it cost a couple hundred bucks or if it were more successful, we'd do it. But we're not willing to pay several thousand extra dollars for a procedure that has a lower success rate and gets the answers wrong a significant portion of the time. That's just my two cents'.

Oh HA thank you so much for this info!!!! I was thinking about PDG, but my insurance does not cover that, there is no way i am going to take the risk and discard good eggies, after hearing this!!

 

[onmymind17]

Hello my beautiful ladies!!!

Thank you all so much for your support, and PadBrat, your right, i am so excited now that i have finally made the decision, i have to call tomorrow for my blood work results, and DH and i have decided to use donor eggs either way, I just dont think my numbers would come back good enough for us to use mine, and i keep thinking about the 4 m/c that we have already had, so i know my eggs are not in good shape. Now all i am stressing about is having to jump through all these hoops, its so frustrating, i mean women get pg all the time, do they test them for vaccinations, or for other issues, no, but me i have to go through all this stuff, its not fair that we cant get pg on our own, and now to have to go through this is even worse. I am trying to take it one day at a time, but i am just waiting for the next shoe to drop. I had my mammogram on saturday, it was not as bad as i thought it would be, actually for me the worst part was my rib on my left side, the machine hit me right there and now i have a sore spot lol. So now i have to wait for the results for that, which i should have by the end of the week, and then there is the blood results, the one thing i am worried about is i know i dont have the vaccination for Rubella, i had it when i was a kid, but i guess its gone now. I found this out when i started with my last RE, and they said well if you get the vaccination for it, then you have to wait 3 mo to TTC, and i said i did not want to do that, and she said well no big deal, just stay away from anybody that would have it. Somehow i just know that this is going to be an issue with this new RE, sigh....... I also have the saline test on wed, which i am not looking forward too. One day at a time right? God I wish this was all over and i knew that we would be doing the IVF.