Debate: - Gun Laws and Self Defence

Unfortunately gun laws wouldn't be nearly as easy to enforce here, due partly to sheer size and population. Also proximity- many illegal guns (there are guns here that are not generally legal to own!) are smuggled in from Mexico. Banning guns outright are unlikely to make them unavailable, people who have malicious intent (gangs, etc.) tend to get them on the black market anyway. The vast majority of licensed gun owners have never harmed anyone, and the vast majority of violent gun users are unlicensed.

I don't believe owning a gun is likely to make you more paranoid unless you're predisposed to it anyway. After all, knives and frying pans have been mentioned as potential alternative weapons a few times, does having them in your kitchen make you feel as if you have to hold a knife behind your back every time you open the door? :) Responsible gun owners have been trained in their use, and the people who are allowed concealed carry- namely military members, cops, government people, bodyguards- have most likely been trained in controlling their fear as well and are unlikely to lose control.
 
The idea of a gun club uneases me :wacko:

Why? I'm curious.
I guess there might be the perception it's a bunch of wackos sitting around caressing their guns, but really it's generally a bunch of people keeping an eye on each other making sure laws are followed so everyone can benefit and people stay safe.

I agree the gun club here educates people on gun safety, and even facilitates recreational uses.. like trap shooting
 
Just as i think his answer would be interesting, i'll ask liam when he gets in what he thinks... i think his view will be much more similar to some of the other posters on here, but certainly not me... if he could bring his rifle home i think he would you know :dohh:

You know that scene on full metal jacket when they all chant "this is my rifle, there are many others like it but this one is mine" .. yeah, liam would be like that.
 
The idea of a gun club uneases me :wacko:

Why? I'm curious.
I guess there might be the perception it's a bunch of wackos sitting around caressing their guns, but really it's generally a bunch of people keeping an eye on each other making sure laws are followed so everyone can benefit and people stay safe.

I think it was bowling for columbine that gave me a bad view on guns and gun clubs.
 
Gun related death per year stats

1.United States - 11,127 (3.601 per 100,000)
2.Germany – 381 (0.466/100,000)
3.France – 255 (0.389/100,000)
4.Canada – 165 (0.484/100,000)
5.United Kingdom – 68 (0.109/100,000)
6.Australia – 65 (0.292/100,000)
7.Japan – 39 (0.030/100,000)


wow.
 
The idea of a gun club uneases me :wacko:

Why? I'm curious.
I guess there might be the perception it's a bunch of wackos sitting around caressing their guns, but really it's generally a bunch of people keeping an eye on each other making sure laws are followed so everyone can benefit and people stay safe.

I think it was bowling for columbine that gave me a bad view on guns and gun clubs.

It was meant to. Michael Moore, right? His movies are eye-opening, but also extremely biased and one-sided unfortunately.
 
Since the thread is now gun laws and self defense..

How do you feel about police officers carrying guns?
 
Yes it was a Michael Moore film. I like him. He can't make stuff up. Maybe 1 sided but that side IS there.
 
Gun related death per year stats

1.United States - 11,127 (3.601 per 100,000)
2.Germany – 381 (0.466/100,000)
3.France – 255 (0.389/100,000)
4.Canada – 165 (0.484/100,000)
5.United Kingdom – 68 (0.109/100,000)
6.Australia – 65 (0.292/100,000)
7.Japan – 39 (0.030/100,000)


wow.

Mmmm, statistics...

And those figures would be a lot different with different populations.

I'd like to know what that includes tbh - are those gun related deaths incl. by police? Accidents? Self defense? Nutjobs?
 
Since the thread is now gun laws and self defense..

How do you feel about police officers carrying guns?

Normal police officers don't carry guns over here. They carry battons and CS Spray. Thats sufficient IMO.
 
Since the thread is now gun laws and self defense..

How do you feel about police officers carrying guns?

Having an opinion on the uk, the police shouldn't carry guns as it just breeds more gun violence.
 
Gun related death per year stats

1.United States - 11,127 (3.601 per 100,000)
2.Germany – 381 (0.466/100,000)
3.France – 255 (0.389/100,000)
4.Canada – 165 (0.484/100,000)
5.United Kingdom – 68 (0.109/100,000)
6.Australia – 65 (0.292/100,000)
7.Japan – 39 (0.030/100,000)


wow.

Mmmm, statistics...

And those figures would be a lot different with different populations.

I'd like to know what that includes tbh - are those gun related deaths incl. by police? Accidents? Self defense? Nutjobs?

In general I think.. and that's just deaths. I'm sure there's A LOT more for injuries.
 
ok liam says:

"ive been trained in reasonable force - you match what they have. if its a fist, then you use fists. the army use escalating force - so if someone shoots, you shoot something bigger."

He also has no problems with americans carrying guns, and didn't seem phased at all by the stats up there ^^ He would have a gun in the house for sport he said, which he plans to do (not on my watch :lol:) - and said as he is trained to use guns, he would use one as a last resort for protection as he knows if all else fails, his gun wouldn't.

Still not having a gun in my house :lol:
 
See the idea of that is so foreign to me.. maybe I'd feel differently if guns were more illegal here...

But police officers don't often shoot to kill, they first shoot to wound (and therefore stop a criminal)... and to kill as an absolute last resort. Taking their gun out period is already kind of an extreme situation, not the everyday... to even take it out they have to write a report up,

When police officers came to visit us in school they weren't even allowed to show us their guns, though they could turn on the sirens etc.

My ex's dad saved a little girl's (4 years old) life with his gun (he was a cop)... he killed her father, but he was holding her hostage with a gun threatening to kill her. :shrug:
 
Gun related death per year stats

1.United States - 11,127 (3.601 per 100,000)
2.Germany – 381 (0.466/100,000)
3.France – 255 (0.389/100,000)
4.Canada – 165 (0.484/100,000)
5.United Kingdom – 68 (0.109/100,000)
6.Australia – 65 (0.292/100,000)
7.Japan – 39 (0.030/100,000)


wow.

Mmmm, statistics...

And those figures would be a lot different with different populations.

I'd like to know what that includes tbh - are those gun related deaths incl. by police? Accidents? Self defense? Nutjobs?
How do you mean 'different with different populations'?

and surely who is holding/shooting the gun is irrelevant. The fact is that people have been killed as a result of gun crime!

Since the thread is now gun laws and self defense..

How do you feel about police officers carrying guns?

Normal police officers don't carry guns over here. They carry battons and CS Spray. Thats sufficient IMO.

I disagree. I dont think they need to carry guns, but I think they should all carry stun guns. Batons and CS spray is only effective at close range...a stun gun gives police greater control from a greater distance
 
Stun gun is a taser gun right?
 
Stun gun is a taser gun right?

erm, not sure. Dont think so. I think a taser is one of those things that has two 'prongs' and needs to be held against a person. A stun gun actually 'fires' two barbs out on wires that then hook onto the offender and delivers a shock, which can then be repeated if required (I think)

DOUBLE POST!! There is more to this in a reply about 4 posts on from this (somehow) :shrug:
 
i think some of our police units use tasers, not all of them.
 
I dislike tasers. I feel there is more abuse because they aren't 'lethal'. I think we have like...5 tasers in the whole country :lol: Police here don't carry guns as a matter of course.
There are armed offender squads and that's enough for 99% of cases I think.
Of all the times I've been on the wrong end of a gun in the US more than half of them have been with a police officer on the other end (and no I wasn't doing anything bad. I was sitting near someone who was under suspicion).
 
Gun related death per year stats

1.United States - 11,127 (3.601 per 100,000)
2.Germany – 381 (0.466/100,000)
3.France – 255 (0.389/100,000)
4.Canada – 165 (0.484/100,000)
5.United Kingdom – 68 (0.109/100,000)
6.Australia – 65 (0.292/100,000)
7.Japan – 39 (0.030/100,000)


wow.

Mmmm, statistics...

And those figures would be a lot different with different populations.

I'd like to know what that includes tbh - are those gun related deaths incl. by police? Accidents? Self defense? Nutjobs?

How do you mean 'different with different populations'?

and surely who is holding/shooting the gun is irrelevant. The fact is that people have been killed as a result of gun crime!

If there are 1000 people in one country and 10,000 people in another, there may be more of a certain type of person in one country, compared to another... I mean the gun deaths in the UK...where it isn't as 'easy' to get hold of a gun - they could be police, whereas in the US it could be police, self defence (as in someone kills someone to save the life of another for example) or so on... You can say here are 10 people, here are another 10...but all you know is there are two sets of 10 people, not who is included in them... That's the problem with statistics.

And I see nothing in those stats that specifically says those deaths are ALL a result of 'gun crime'.

Anyway, I need to go and get a shower before I get in trouble!!
 

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